Graham Spiers has always been quite a curious chap too me.
He first came onto the scene as a wing man to that bitter auld Rangers hater Gerry McNee on STV with Jim Delahunt making up this unholy triumvirate of bitter and twisted Rangers haters. Each weekend you would find this three hunched over in their stv chairs wailing and gnashing their teeth at how futile Celtics Challenge was to the great Rangers Nine in a row side of that time.
I will get to how Graham Spiers got the gig in another blog but after the first bout of inverse snobbery. It soon became very clear that this guy didn’t have a fucking clue what he was talking about and that there were far more deserving pundits on Scottish Association Football that he was depriving of Air-time
What I’am about to reveal too you Dear Reader is shocking and will rock sports Journalism too its very foundations. It shows Graham Spiers as nothing more than a bitter, twisted, hate-filled individual with a very poisonous bigoted axe to grind with Rangers Football Club.
In fact you will see by reading this that he is nothing more than a male version of Angela Haggerty.
Well that is not exactly true at least Angela Haggerty has a H.N.D in Journalism. As far as I am aware Spiers couldnt even complete his pseudo degree of Theology -or the bullshiters magnet as it is known in the trade- a degree he just managed to scrape into no doubt with helping hand from his Father the Baptist Minister pulling a few strings.
But let that be a lesson to any up and coming Sports Journalist fuck knocking your pan in for 4 years doing a Journalism degree or even a masters after that.
Fuck freezing yer tit’s or arse’s off on crisp Winters nights in shite-holes the likes of Cappielow.
Just fucking Rangers Hate till you cant Rangers hate no more.
Get involved in the feeding frenzy of I can hate Rangers more than you that passes for sports Journalism -and is allowed to fester- in Scotland.
Blame Rangers Football Club for all of Scotland’s societies evils and wooooosh right up the Scottish media’s greasy bigoted anti-British pole you will go.
The guy you see in the picture above metaphorically carving up the stuffed turkey that is Graham Spiers is a gentleman by the name of David Leggat and is my little tip of the bowler hat to the man.
Now this guy David Leggat has been banging on about Spiers for years and confirmed my feelings that Spiers wasnt just a very, very shite Football Journo but there was something more sinister to Spiersy’s Rangers hating game and I believe that it was he who coined the moniker “The Odious creep” for him.
You will find that this moniker is apt with his condescending sexist attitude to the “Ghirls” Brenda and Jane who rubbed one out with the rest off the hate-filled gang in this Rangers hating who could wank the highest that passed for a serious football blog. He himself is quite a randy bugger and comes across as horny as a two dicked Martin Luther King Jnr -His Baptist Hero who tried too preach the “go forth and multiply” bit of the good book with anything in a skirt- with tales of wining and dining blondes with real breasts unlike wee Craigy Whytes Swedish bit of fluff.
I will give credit too Graham Spiers Baptist upbringing as he dose not swear once. Oh yes he fecks with the best of them just like he does in his twitter feed but not one single swear or sectarian slur word passes his keyboard when all around him are filling their boots.
You will find that Spiersy claim to be a Rangers fan- which he still claims in the blog- proved to be nothing but bunkum when he refers to his beloved Rangers as “RANKERS” and that’s just for starters.
Oh the mask has well and truly slipped dear reader to reveal what we all knew that Spiersy was a Bheast in sheeps clothing.
You will find how a one timed Journalist with a self proclaimed high quality broadsheet -The London Times- operates. How he back stabs his pals -poor auld Shug Keevins gets a right roasting- in the Journalist world with contempt and loathing for them.
You will find his snobbery towards the rank and file bigots on the blog who cant provide him with info and his total arse licking of those who he thinks he can the Don Dionsio Roger Mitchell being a prime example and boy the love in from the time Roger picked Spiersy out of the huddle of Sports Journalists and groomed him into the man he is is still very much rampant.
You will find that Spiersy was not just a run of the mill lurker/poster but he made it on to the RTC’s first 11 team sheet on the day Rangers went into Administration as…
“Lb. Onx3. Gemmell. Totally respected bluenose.”
Now lets remind ourselves that the Rangers Tax Case Blog was set up with the mission statement that….
I have information on Rangers’ tax case, and I will use this blog to provide the details of what Rangers FC have done, why it was illegal, and what the implications are for one of the largest football clubs in Britain
Right with out further ado I will post all Graham Spiers posts for the year 2011 as he does go OnandOnandOn a bit
Please understand that the following is copied and paste from my source and might look a bit of a dugs dinner but I can not be arsed separating it all for you.
But please do dig as theres loads of fun things to find.
Another ‘Liar’ Steps Forward 2 92 2532 42 4/5/2011 12:16:0 OnandOnandOnand 50 1 “Tilldeath, your post misses the point made many times by RTC. The normal route out of administration is by way of a Company Voluntary Arrangement (‘CVA’), this is what Bryan Jackson successfully negotiated for Dundee. In that case, HMRC were due normal crown debts and accepted the proposal on the basis that is was better to get something than nothing.
That simply isn’t the case here. HMRC are seeking to make an example and it is inconceivable that they will agree to a CVA. As the CVA needs the approval of 75% of those creditors responding to the proposal, that threshhold for acceptance will not be met (simple arithmetic, even if they are only due £24m, they are likely to represent at least 25% of the creditors of the club). If the CVA is not accepted, liquidation then follows and we are into a whole different realm. Rangers will cease to exist in its present form, they may have to start from scratch again but who would want to go to Ibrox to see Rangers 2011 playing diddy teams week after week….. who would want to play for them?”
Another ‘Liar’ Steps Forward 2 94 2534 44 4/5/2011 12:29:0 OnandOnandOnand 50 2 “Boab, the smart money will be on the Craig Whyte corporate vehicle taking an assignation of the LBG security which has been on the record for ages. Insolvency law can allow fresh charges, such as Floating Charges and Standard Securities, to be struck down if granted within a specified period prior to the insolvency, an assignation keeps the original security in place, just changes who is beneficially entitled to it. CW will get to decide who buys Ibrox and Murray Park, not an Administrator, as he will hold the Standard Securities, the key legal documents here. Even an Administrator can’t over-rule this, although may challenge any sale if he/she feels it was at undervalue”
Another ‘Liar’ Steps Forward 2 96 2536 46 4/5/2011 12:43:0 OnandOnandOnand 50 3 “Good news, everyone, the Sunday Times Rich List Top !000 is due to be published this weekend, surely we’ll see billionaire Craig Whyte enter the charts in the low hundreds, dispelling once and for all the notion that he doesn’t have the money to do this deal”
Another ‘Liar’ Steps Forward 2 99 2539 49 4/5/2011 12:57:0 OnandOnandOnand 50 4 “Errrrrr, well said, Boab, I’ll take my tongue out of my cheek now…….”
Another ‘Liar’ Steps Forward 3 103 2543 3 4/5/2011 14:10:0 OnandOnandOnand 50 5 “Boab,
Re your point on the playing squad being the most valuable asset, I agree with the point you make, subject to the proviso that, on liquidation, how many of the contracts will be broken, allowing the players to walk at no realised value? Even if the contracts hold and value is realised, these assets fall into the Floating Charge pot. How is this divided? Administrator’s fees, then the Floating Charge holder (Craig Whyte) for as much of his debt isn’t covered by the standard securities. There is a portion of this money that may go to the ordinary creditors under what’s called the prescribed part, roughly 20% of the net realisations. In summary, a good sale of players goes back into Mr Whyte’s coffers. HMRC have no say in this whatsovever, they are just ordinary creditors.”
Another ‘Liar’ Steps Forward 3 106 2546 6 4/5/2011 14:25:0 OnandOnandOnand 50 6 “Boab,
The point about a security is that it’s enforeceable and carries the power to sell the assets secured, by the creditor personally in the case of the Standard Security, and the Administrator in the case of the Floating Charge. You can be pretty sure that any smart businessman will exact as much of a return as he can.
Having said all that, an ideal outcome for Whyte, and possibly Rangers, would be for a deal to be cobbled together whereby Rangers 2011 stay in the SPL with maybe -25 points at the start of the season. Whyte then rents out Ibrox to Rangers 2011 so he doesn’t need to sell Ibrox.”
Another ‘Liar’ Steps Forward 3 114 2554 14 4/5/2011 17:11:0 OnandOnandOnand 50 7 “RTC, I think you misunderstood the point I was making. I’m not suggesting that the tax problem could be dealt with by going straight to a CVA. Rangers would go into Administration, we both agree on that. As in all administrations there are then 3 ways it will end. 1. The administrator trades the company out of trouble, no chance here. 2. The administrator proposes a CVA to get some pennies in the pound to creditors. I’ve demonstrated why this won’t work. 3. the company goes into liquidation. I would also point out that HMRC could kill the administration at the proposals stage at the meeting of creditors, if held, depending on how much of a claim the administrator allows. Even if the administrator chooses not to hold a meeting, HMRC can demand one, providing they cover the costs of calling the meeting”
Another ‘Liar’ Steps Forward 4 167 2607 17 6/5/2011 10:7:0 OnandOnandOnand 50 8 “Or, as I said in my earlier posting, Whyte could have the existing securities assigned to him, keeping them in place and avoiding all of the questions posed here”
Another ‘Liar’ Steps Forward 4 171 2611 21 6/5/2011 10:44:0 OnandOnandOnand 50 9 “Boab, no, don’t think I said that and yes, a floating charge cover ALL assets not otherwise charged or excluded by agreement 7up free, I doubt the Administrator would bring such a challenge, who else would? I agree that any creditor may challenge (Bankruptcy (Scotland) Act 1985 section 36 (4)) but is that likely?”
Another ‘Liar’ Steps Forward 4 172 2612 22 6/5/2011 10:51:0 OnandOnandOnand 50 10 “Boab, no, don’t think I said that and yes, a floating charge cover ALL assets not otherwise charged or excluded by agreement 7up free, I doubt the Administrator would bring such a challenge, who else would? I agree that any creditor may challenge (Bankruptcy (Scotland) Act 1985 section 36 (4)) but is that likely?
(Posted this in the wrong bit earlier……..)”
Another ‘Liar’ Steps Forward 4 179 2619 29 6/5/2011 12:6:0 OnandOnandOnand 50 11 “7upfree, I think we both agree that this will end in liquidation, there really is no way to avoid it. I won’t repeat my earlier postings on this, see above if you’re interested in my reasoning. Given that Mr Whyte is no stranger to insolvency proceedings, I’m sure he’s worked that one out already and is a man with a plan….”
Another ‘Liar’ Steps Forward 5 212 2678 12 6/5/2011 20:21:0 OnandOnandOnand 50 12 “Good to see my assertion that the debt would be assigned was on the money. I’m sure the rest of my analysis is just as valid”
Blinded by the Whyte 2 91 2753 41 7/5/2011 8:38:0 OnandOnandOnand 38 1 “droid, sorry, Mr Bull (what an apt name) isn’t the Lloyds link, if you look at the accounts for Merchant Corporate Recovery plc, published some 7 months late and of which Mr Whyte is a director,noproblems with corporate governance there then, you will see that the bankers are. . . . . . . . . . . Lloyds Banking Group.”
Blinded by the Whyte 3 108 2770 8 7/5/2011 10:32:0 OnandOnandOnand 38 2 “3 men in a boat
Who is now at the helm at Rangers? After last night’s stab in the back statement from Johnstone, you can bet your last pound that the present board will go. Who will replace them?
We know that Whyte and Betts will be there. Betts as finance director? He isn’t a CA, doesn’t seem to have any managerial experience and spend his time doing HP and lease deals. (see his website, listed in other posts). Both Whyte and Betts are no strangers to insolvency, perhaps that’s what qualifies them to be on the board.
Andrew Ellis is a cert too, another damn fine chap, eh. Who else? Is it a coincidence that Mr Whyte has been often photographed with James Mortimer, a true Rangers fan to the core, prick him, his blood is True Blue and a man with extensive managerial experience. That’s four on the board, never a good idea to have an even number of directors. Who else? Any suggestions?
Oh, and it’s a dead cert that Bain will go, no matter what they say, he was lukewarm at Whyte’s bid, he can’t possibly stay”
Blinded by the Whyte 7 327 3007 27 9/5/2011 22:16:0 OnandOnandOnand 38 3 “Guys, this chat is getting a bit boring. The RTC blog is seen as a forum for informed discussion for all, I really thought Jean’s contribution signifies all that is good here, a non-partisan exchange of views and comment asking searching questions and formulating conclusions. This banter on a partisan basis is not what the site is about. (and, reading some posts, a few glasses of wine might have been imbibed and all sense of spelling/grammar lost………..lol. mine’s a pint and I would drink that pint with anyone on this forum)
RTC, while I am in favour of a sharing of views, we await your posting tonight/tomorrow. Let’s just stop posting here. Wait for your next blog. Then the feeding frenzy can begin again….”
Blinded by the Whyte 7 341 3021 41 9/5/2011 23:7:0 OnandOnandOnand 38 4 “Guinessjohn, I was right when I said the debt would be assigned and no new securities would be created, and my various postings regarding the administration have a great deal more validity and authority than yours, see my post re new directors and see how it pans out in the next few days………… I suspect you are one of the imbibers I was referring to”
Blinded by the Whyte 7 349 3029 49 9/5/2011 23:42:0 OnandOnandOnand 38 5 “Kind of proves my point, you haven’t a clue and aren’t interested in any proper debate, just respond with gibberish. I think I’ll wait for the next RTC article before posting again, meanwhile,enjoy your Guinness, John”
Blinded by the Whyte 9 422 3108 22 10/5/2011 14:44:0 OnandOnandOnand 38 6 “Has anyone seen Andrew Ellis? Where is the alleged 25% shareholder? I think we should be told…..lol”
The Tribunal: Is it actually finished? 3 125 3474 25 13/5/2011 11:58:0 OnandOnandOnand 39 1 “Sorry, I may have missed the information being posted but was the Hearing concluded on the 6th of May? I’m sure someone would have leaked that information by now.”
Do you want know a secret? 1 35 3738 35 24/5/2011 8:12:0 OnandOnandOnand 18 1 “I’m a bit perplexed about this post by RTC as it shows a basic misunderstanding of how companies are formed. If you want to, you can buy an off the shelf company from various business that specialise in this service. Jordans are one of them, there are many others. They set up a company on spec, they appoint directors and the shares are held by a nominee company or individual. It’s common practice, if you want to see how it’s done, go to http://www.jordans.co.uk/companyformation/ or if you want a Scottish company, go to http://www.millar-bryce.com/companyform.htm
Anyone can buy thisoff the shelf company, new directors are appointedand the name is often changed but there is no legal obligation to notify the Registrar of Companies of a change of shareholding until the next Annual Return is lodged, in this case in about December 2011 but that can be extended by playing around with the accounting reference date.
There’s nothing sinister here, so far, just the same information as you get in any case where a company is bought off the shelf”
Do you want know a secret? 1 38 3742 38 24/5/2011 8:39:0 OnandOnandOnand 18 2 “Cairn are also financial advisers to Merchant Capital, linked to Merchant House Group in which Whyte has a well documented stake. Nothing unusual about someone bringing in trusted advisors and as Rangers are a PLUS company, they need to have Nominated Advisors (Nomads in financial speak). Guys, the paranoia is building, let’s just stick to facts and reasoned discussion, for which this blog is rightly known.”
Do you want know a secret? 2 55 3764 5 24/5/2011 10:50:0 OnandOnandOnand 18 3 “Tomtom, an interesting post. Leaving aside that Ellis is a bit of a cheapskate in buying an off the shelf company (most experienced takeover specialists set up a bespoke company with memo and articles to suit themselves but that costs money, not just the £140.00 to buy a Jordan’s off the shelf), it’s not unusual for businessmen to hold companies in reserve as non-trading or dormant companies so they have a corporate vehicle available when needed. The date of incorporation and it’s significance is indeed speculation but I think there’s little in it. Whyte not coming on as a director until February probably means they chose this company as a vehicle and were looking to do the deal in February. One wouldn’t go on as a director until the offer was ready to be chrystallised. A better ground for speculation would be to ask what happened between February and May when the deal was concluded.”
Do you want know a secret? 2 60 3772 10 24/5/2011 11:7:0 OnandOnandOnand 18 4 “Boab, much of what you say agrees with my earlier posting. Wavetower (now known as The Rangers FC Group Limited) is a private limited company and has no duty to disclose its shareholdings until it submits its annual return. Whyte either put up the money himself or borrowed the money to pay back Lloyds, we’ll probably never know. TRFCG Limited has no charges registered against it so any loan is unsecured for now ( a lender has 21 days from creation of a security to register it so if you assume the security was granted on takeover day, any lender has until 28th May to register the security). I suspect if the money was borrowed, there will be a share transfer form of Whyte’s/Liberty capital’s shares in favour of the lender, rather than relying on a security”
Do you want know a secret? 2 62 3774 12 24/5/2011 11:16:0 OnandOnandOnand 18 5 “tomtom, having been involved in many takeovers of varying businesses, I can say with confidence that Whyte has been reading Takeovers For Dummies, everything about it is predictable, from the £1 share price device (saves you having to offer for the other shares and disclose the true price, also saves on stamp duty) to the assignation of securities and sacking of the board, all utterly predictable and methods used many times before. The original purpose of this blog, to expose the tax case, is the true meat in this matter and RTC is to be applauded for bringing this to the fore in an articulate and intelligent way. It is how Whyte will deal with this that is the interesting part.
Go on, speculate to your heart’s content but don’t see mysteries where there are none.”
Do you want know a secret? 2 65 3785 15 24/5/2011 12:7:0 OnandOnandOnand 18 6 “James Mortimer would be a good choice, he’s Rangers through and through (I’ve posted this before on another thread here), don’t think they would need any more directors, 5 is enough, assuming Bain and McIntyre go”
Rangers have nothing to worry about 2 99 4739 49 1/6/2011 9:25:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 1 “The purchase of the debt by taking an assignation takes a new twist. RTC, it may benefit you to have a look at the mortgage charges section of the company record of The Rangers Football Club plc, an MG05 has been lodged, can’t see the detail as it only hit the register yesterday. Remember, if anything has been done to affect the securities in place, Whyte had 21 days to notify Companies House, looks like this is the notification. I think it will be publicly available later today or tomorrow”
Rangers have nothing to worry about 3 107 4747 7 1/6/2011 11:25:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 2 “RTC,
You might have to be a subscriber to Companies House Direct to access it
Try this link
The MG05 is still showing as not available but lodged yesterday. Best wait until tomorrow, haven’t a clue what it says but the form is used where assets are released from a charge.”
Rangers have nothing to worry about 3 108 4748 8 1/6/2011 11:27:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 3 “RTC, could you delete my last post after checking, the link might give unauthorised access to Companies House Direct. Thanks”
New Rangers Mystery: Is a deal in the works? 3 109 5307 9 5/6/2011 13:11:0 OnandOnandOnand 53 1 “Another great post, RTC, very thought provoking. I just worry about the timeline, I just don’t think there has been enough time between CTW taking over Rangers and the form being lodged at Companies House for CTW to have done a deal with HMRC. My experience of dealing with HMRC is that they don’t move at that speed and certainly wouldn’t have been speaking to the Whyte camp before takeover, they would have no legal right to talk to them.
Pledging future revenue streams (not all tickets, just the specified number, although the draftsmanship here is pretty sloppy, it starts off referring to tickets, season tickets……. then goes on to define ‘tickets’ as the season tickets, thereby excluding all other tickets) suggests to me that they are providing security on an annual basis for a regular revolving loan, such as the Ticketis, or whatever they’re called, advance on season tickets. If you know how much the tickets sell for, less VAT, you can work out how much he’s borrowing each season.
As an aside, I have a few ideas for future blogs, all on the basis of publicly available information, it’s just that no-one has gone public that they have joined up the dots. You probably have my email address, feel free to contact me, I don’t want to post on here and steal your thunder (or get slapped with a Carter – Ruck writ)”
New Rangers Mystery: Is a deal in the works? 4 168 5374 18 5/6/2011 20:23:0 OnandOnandOnand 53 2 “tomtom, the Wavetower RFC/Group Limited isn’t showing any charges against it as of today’s date.
An asset transfer is possible and not illegal if it’s for proper value but if there were actually such a transfer, you would expect to see the other securities released”
New Rangers Mystery: Is a deal in the works? 4 172 5378 22 5/6/2011 20:38:0 OnandOnandOnand 53 3 “JP, I must have missed something, why the reference to Clarke Willmott?”
New Rangers Mystery: Is a deal in the works? 4 176 5382 26 5/6/2011 20:52:0 OnandOnandOnand 53 4 “Adam, interesting theory but why would a deed in 1999 refer to ticket sales for 4 years commencing this season coming as the released assets? Why would BOS release them in the first place?”
New Rangers Mystery: Is a deal in the works? 4 183 5389 33 5/6/2011 21:7:0 OnandOnandOnand 53 5 “Thanks, JP, didn’t know that, haven’t a clue who they act for, if the form is signed by Phill Betts and Craig Whyte as other have suggested, that must mean Clarke Willmott have been acting for them but that’s not my understanding. it just gets stranger.
Adam, okay (I’m now devil’s advocate, not saying you are wrong) why use such specific figures, it’s not 25,000, it’s 23,154 and 27,017 season tickets. It only makes sense of some kind if those tickets represent the advance being made on an annual basis, see my earlier post about 1.15pm today”
New Rangers Mystery: Is a deal in the works? 4 185 5391 35 5/6/2011 21:10:0 OnandOnandOnand 53 6 “JP, re your post at 9.07, I can’t understand why CTW would discharge the security if he or more properly his company, Wavetower, had the debt assigned to it per AJ statement. If the security is discharged, I would expect to see other deeds appearing on the record”
New Rangers Mystery: Is a deal in the works? 4 189 5395 39 5/6/2011 21:24:0 OnandOnandOnand 53 7 “tomtom, if all the assets are discharged, you can’t use form MG05s, you have to use MG03s. In this case, it seems everything has been released except certain ticket money. By leaving the ticket money in, you have to use MG05s”
New Rangers Mystery: Is a deal in the works? 4 197 5403 47 5/6/2011 22:3:0 OnandOnandOnand 53 8 “Duggie, Adam, Wobbly, yes, it’s a lot of huffing but RTCis right to bring it up. Next post please, RTC!!
A question, which has nothing to do with Rangers accounts. What are the rules on reporting significant events which would affect one’s interpretation of a balance sheet if the event occurred after the end of the period reported on but before the accounts were signed off?”
New Rangers Mystery: Is a deal in the works? 5 206 5412 6 5/6/2011 22:19:0 OnandOnandOnand 53 9 “RTC, good to see you tonight, we missed you.
As I suspect you have an accountancy background, could you comment on my last posting about post balance sheet events?”
New Rangers Mystery: Is a deal in the works? 5 211 5417 11 5/6/2011 22:29:0 OnandOnandOnand 53 10 “tomtom, you use MG05s if you release assets, in this case everything except the ST money. You use MG03s if you are discharging the whole security, in effect, removing it from the register. So, in summary, the floating charge to BOS/Lloyds still stands, but is only good for the season ticket money”
New Rangers Mystery: Is a deal in the works? 5 215 5421 15 5/6/2011 22:36:0 OnandOnandOnand 53 11 “Adam, Companies House don’t give you copies of the actual floating charge, they just keep records of its existance. If you want to see the deed itself, you have to go through the Land Register
New Rangers Mystery: Is a deal in the works? 5 221 5427 21 5/6/2011 22:46:0 OnandOnandOnand 53 12 “Guys, been an interesting night, I have to go to bed as a) Rambo has finished on Channel 5 and b) have an early morning flight to London for meetings with asset stripping vultures………… it’s what I do but not for CTW.
RTC, you may have to keep this site running for some time yet, I don’t see any resolution to the tax case anytime soon, a mere mortal like me, never mind an esteemed QC, could keep this tax case running for a ages.
Think on what I said re reporting and the fit and proper person test……..”
New Rangers Mystery: Is a deal in the works? 5 245 5453 45 6/6/2011 9:31:0 OnandOnandOnand 53 13 “The undertaking was that a circular to shareholders would be posted by 6th June, I’m guessing second class, so all you shareholders out there, don’t expect to hear anything before Wednesday at the earliest, not that you’re going to hear anything of any substance.”
Rangers’ Circular Released 1 32 5667 32 6/6/2011 19:1:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 1 “Northpoint are printers who specialise in financial documents, they’re actually quite good.
Rangers’ Circular Released 3 144 5796 44 6/6/2011 22:55:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 2 “RTC, your post at 10.50pm kind of answers a question I asked in another blog posting. Now use your curiosity to join the dots.
Another point. Why 90 days?”
Rangers’ Circular Released 5 236 5889 36 7/6/2011 12:7:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 3 “Forgive me if I’m mistaken (and I’m sure I will corrected on here in double quick time) but wasn’t there a rumour that Jelavic’s transfer had been funded by Ticketus money, at least in part? If that rumour is true, then the Ticketus involvement goes back to the old board and part of this season’s money will have been pledged to them. In effect, CW has inherited the position, rather than creating it although I’m sure he will now use the facility to the limit.
Ignoring the basic drafting ambiguities of the MG05s, it was signed by Messrs Whyte and Betts on behalf of the creditor beneficially entitled to the security which is evidence that the original Lloyds debt has been assigned. If I wanted to keep quiet about the Ticketus involvement, I would then further assign that part of the security covering their liability to Ticketus, hence the involvement of Clarke Willmott. Assignations don’t need to be made public.”
Rangers’ Circular Released 7 305 5960 5 7/6/2011 19:58:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 4 “How to avoid Administration…………
Simple, if you are relying on the original BOS security granted in 1999, you are entitled to appoint an Administrative Receiver, not an Administrator. This is available where the Floating Charge was created before 15th September 2003 when the law was revamped. An Administrative Receivership is a totally different insolvency procedure, most notably in that the Receiver acts for the chargeholder, not the creditors. If Whyte has spent £18m paying off the loan to LTSB, spent £5m on players, paid the small tax bill and various others, including penalties and fees, up to, say £30m, he will then persuade the Receiver to transfer the assets to him as an offset arrangement. Job done. HMRC will moan but there will be revised valuations on a break up basis that shows £30m is a reasonable price. So the Whyte camp will have bought Rangers Football Club for £30m, debt free, will trade for a year or two then sell at a huge profit.
On that analysis, Whyte needs to spend some money to get his loan up to the level where he can set off, so expect some signings.
Only a theory, mind”
Rangers’ Circular Released 7 311 5966 11 7/6/2011 20:16:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 5 “tomtom
I understand what you’re saying but Murray tried to sell a debt-ridden club. I can assure you, a debt free Rangers making a profit would sell without any problems”
Rangers’ Circular Released 7 318 5973 18 7/6/2011 20:28:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 6 “Just to be clear, a pre-pack Administration is one where the creditors really get stuffed royally. What happens is that the deal to sell the assets, or transfer them in a set off to the chargeholder is all worked out in advance, the Administrator is appointed by the court or chargeholder and on day one, the sale takes place. The creditors are presented with a fait accomplit and no 25% creditor can veto it. Pre-packs don’t happen as much as the profession brought in a set of criteria (SIP 16) which make them more difficult to achieve. As I posted earlier, Whyte doesn’t even need to do a pre-pack to stuff the creditors.
In case you don’t think an Insolvency Practitioner would go along with this, let me assure you that there are those who would and no bat an eyelid”
Rangers’ Circular Released 7 319 5974 19 7/6/2011 20:34:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 7 “tomtom, again, I can’t disagree with the thrust of your argument but the ‘insolvency event’ will end a lot of the overpriced contracts, I think Rangers will be a leaner operation with Whyte running it”
Rangers’ Circular Released 7 323 5978 23 7/6/2011 20:51:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 8 “jbj, yes, Whyte can sell to anyone he wants.
OldThim, you might want to look at SIP 16, confirms your view (see items 8 and 12, makes it clear creditors have no say and IP can hide behind commercial confidentiality to not give an explanation.)
here’s the link for that
Rangers’ Circular Released 7 327 5982 27 7/6/2011 21:21:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 9 “burton, it’s a funny old world, isn’t it? None of it would be done deliberately, sometimes that’s just how the dice land.
As I said before, it’s all just a theory……”
Rangers’ Circular Released 7 331 5986 31 7/6/2011 21:30:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 10 “Duggie, the administrative receiver would transfer the assets to a Whyte company to satisfy the secured debt, it would be a new company, and all the debt would be left in the old Rangers Football Club. It’s the new company that continues to trade, obviously, allowing for all the caveats about league position, etc”
Rangers’ Circular Released 7 333 5988 33 7/6/2011 21:47:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 11 “Taxman, sorry, I didn’t see your post. You will have to ask Murray why he didn’t do it. I suggest it might be because he doesn’t think the same way as Whyte, who probably views all distressed deals from an insolvency angle.”
Rangers’ Circular Released 7 339 5994 39 7/6/2011 22:5:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 12 “Duggie, the brand name would be one of the assets bought. There is a provision against using prohibited names if you trade a new company under the same or similar name as the company the has suffered the ‘insolvency event’. It’s a criminal offence under 216 of the Insolvency Act 1986 to use a prohibited name but the section doesn’t apply if you buy the name from the insolvency practitioner dealing with the case”
Rangers’ Circular Released 7 344 5999 44 7/6/2011 22:9:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 13 “To stand shoulder to shoulder with The Don is an honour indeed. I wish it was under happier circumstances”
Rangers’ Circular Released 8 353 6008 3 7/6/2011 22:19:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 14 “tomtom
Well said, I can’t disagree with you. The authors of Rangers’ misfortune were the previous boards from 2000 onwards and I hope that HMRC seek to hold them personally liable in due course. I take no pleasure either in showing how the Whyte camp can use this to their advantage but the fact is, they can. They didn’t make the problem but they can sort it. What is abundantly clear is that Rangers were doomed as soon as the assessments were raised and the old board didn’t have the courage to tell the fans the truth. They should be ashamed of themselves and for AJ to lecture about Whyte when AJ must have known that, even under his stewardship, it could only end in administration.”
Rangers’ Circular Released 8 356 6011 6 7/6/2011 22:38:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 15 “Just to cheer you up and give you hope, if one reads the MG05s to say that all assets EXCEPT the season ticket money were released, then the theory expunded by myself and The Don falls to pieces as there is nothing covered by the floating charge that the receiver can sell, apart from future season books. I’ve already expressed the view that the MG05s is badly drafted mince, to be sure what has happened, you would need to look at the original signed agreements and documents and you won’t get to see them.”
Rangers’ Circular Released 8 366 6021 16 7/6/2011 23:5:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 16 “Taxman, phoenix Rangers would have no liability at all for the sins of the fathers.
Burton, nope, the HMRC debt is irrelevant to them, it’s just the excuse to trigger the insolvency event, may be this year or next, doubt if it will go on beyond 2012.”
Rangers’ Circular Released 8 367 6022 17 7/6/2011 23:12:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 17 “Night, fellow bloggers”
Rangers’ Circular Released 9 430 6085 30 8/6/2011 15:2:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 18 “The Don @ 1.59pm
The choice of Receiver is important and there will be assurances given prior to appointment. That’s just the way these things work. The mechanics are indeed as you narrate or a close version thereto.
Inhibitions are not such a problem nowadays. I haven’t got time to give chapter and verse and check what I say is correct but you should refer to the Bankruptcy and Diligence (Scotland) Act 2007.
I regret I won’t be able to contribute much to this blog for a while due to business committments, I have enjoyed your comments immensely, you wise not so old owl. Keep them on the straight and narrow……”
Rangers’ Circular Released 14 651 6306 1 9/6/2011 22:19:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 19 “The Rangers FC Group Limited bought and holds Muray’s shares in the Club. The Rangers FC Group Limited is owned 100% by Liberty Capital Limited. Ellis has no shares. See the statement this item of the blog is all about, page 1, para 2. Ellis is a director, not a shareholder and it’s 2 -1 against him with Whyte and Betts voting together in a directors’ vote. Ellis is an irrelevance, this is the Craig Whyte show, Craig Whyte controls the Club.”
Rangers’ Circular Released 14 667 6322 17 9/6/2011 23:17:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 20 “Can I remind people what I said in my earlier post. For the Receivership route to work, Whyte has to spend quite a bit more money than the £18m he paid LTSB (or what ever he actually had to pay). His ‘loan account’ made up of the LTSB payment and the other advances he makes in terms of the statement he gave (guys, he spelled it out when he said the money promised would be added to the security in the case of an insolvency event) all have to add up to a value equivalent to the break-up value of the Club. At that point, he will call in the receiver, set off his debt against the assets rather than paying cash and get a New Club, free of debt. He really does need to spend some money to achieve this, hence my comment that there will be money for signings and some repairs. My guess is that he will spend £30m. If, and I accept it is a big if, he then sells a few years later for £50m, he will make £20m profit, that is his return on investment.
I think there will be a normal summer signing season, a few good but not very expensive names, no signings in winter as he will have put enough money in by then. If he’s going to pull the plug, will be in March. I suspect he might have done so this March if he had been able to complete the deal. Do what is needed in March, gives you time to be up and running in time to sell new season books.
This assumes the FTT was delayed and reconvenes in November. I have a good source that confirms this is the case.
There is some suggestion he is ‘taking’ the Ticketus money, trousering it. It’s a plc, for goodness sake, that’s just theft and he’s not that daft. He will use Ticketus as a bridging finance facility and was lumbered with it by the previous board. I suspect he has no connection with Ticketus at all and would rather they weren’t there.”
Rangers’ Circular Released 14 672 6327 22 9/6/2011 23:50:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 21 “Barry, HMRC box from the back foot all the time. I can’t remember the last time I was dealing with an ‘insolvency event’ where HMRC didn’t figure as a large or largest creditor, but you have to put it into perspective. The number of businesses failings in Scotland is quite modest, about 1100 or so in the year April 2010 to April 2011
I can’t find an up to date number for total businesses in Scotland but see this link,
which suggests over 263,000 businesses in 2006 so HMRC have a problem with bad debt but not that huge, well not in comparison to the Vodaphone tax let off!!
Sorry, there’s not a scenario where HMRC are victorious unless the Whyte camp mess it up, although, yes, I’ve seen that happen too.
What I’m saying is that, in the scheme of things, the tax loss if HMRC win but collect nothing is nothing new. Yes, it would build some schools but they’re used to it.
If they want to make an example of Rangers, much better to go for the directors personally, that really would send the signal to others in the EBT schemes to settle up so, in that sense, insolvency would be just what HMRC really want.”
Rangers’ Circular Released 14 674 6329 24 10/6/2011 0:6:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 22 “Lizard King, you’re right. Who would pay £50m for a team, debt free (apart from Ticketus millstone) but in the SPL? When does the Sky contract come up for renewal?
In the short term, Rangers will have money for outright signings or loan players. They will start the season full pelt. It will only get interesting after the New Year when Whyte has to make decisions as to how he proceeds.
PS thanks for the compliment. If you want good news, go back and re-read RTC’s posting quoting from the HMRC manual about issuing personal liability notices.”
Rangers’ Circular Released 14 675 6330 25 10/6/2011 0:11:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 23 “Cautious Dave……………
AJ is an honorable guy????? So what was his plan B if the tax case went against the club? I’m guessing it was administration, if he had one. The suggestion that they would have ring-fenced the sb money was absurd”
Rangers’ Circular Released 14 681 6336 31 10/6/2011 0:48:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 24 “RTC, why will he have to play his hand in the next 8-10 weeks?”
Rangers’ Circular Released 14 684 6340 34 10/6/2011 1:20:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 25 “Easy, I would be up for that”
Rangers’ Circular Released 14 685 6342 35 10/6/2011 1:29:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 26 “RTC for the judge, he’s proven his impartiality, the Don for the prosecution (that would be a real role revesal,, methinks), myself for the defence, of ctw but not the old board”
Rangers’ Circular Released 15 710 6368 10 10/6/2011 11:46:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 27 “Barry, 9.45, sorry, I can’t predict what HMRC will do. I can’t say I’ve ever known them to pursue directors but the option is there and if this is a really blatant case, this might be a choice one to test the waters. Maybe another poster on here can shed light on theattitude of HMRC to taking personal action.”
Rangers’ Circular Released 20 994 6669 44 15/6/2011 23:54:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 28 “Gaz, the £1 CW paid over was for Sir Minty’s shares, it had nothing directly to do with the assets or securities. Paying only a pound for shares is not unusual, it means all the takover rules about buying the remaining shares can be sidestepped as the Takeover Panel are not then going to insist you buy the rest of the shares at that price. It also saves a small fortune in stamp duty on the consideration for the shares. I’m confident that Sir Minty will be compensated in other ways, all perfectly legal. You employ hoardes of lawyers to make sure you stay within the law”
Rangers’ Circular Released 21 1020 6695 20 16/6/2011 13:31:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 29 “Black Knight, I have no idea which article you are quoting from but there is no possibility whatsoever that Rangers are in administrative receivership ‘on the quite’. All insolvency procedures are public and require publicity by way of advertisement in the Edinburgh Gazette and newspapers. If you want to check the Gazette yourself, follow this link
Further, Rangers are listed on the PLUS market, an announcement would have to be made.
Sorry mate, your postings on this are way off the mark.”
Rangers’ Circular Released 21 1021 6696 21 16/6/2011 13:32:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 30 “where’s my spellchecker………. of course I meant ‘on the quiet'”
Rangers’ Circular Released 21 1026 6701 26 16/6/2011 14:32:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 31 “Black Knight @1.51pm, yes you are utterly and totally wrong, sorry, there is NO WAY, as you said. The recent Gazette references to Rangers relate to the change of director details we all know about, the MG05s and other matters, nothing to do with receivership. Maybe you should seek out an article about how receivers are appointed. Any reputable writer would confirm the need for publicity for the appointment.”
Rangers’ Circular Released 21 1030 6705 30 16/6/2011 14:55:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 32 “Is this the Andrew Dickson who appears to be seen by some as a man of mystery………?
Only been there since 1991……
I think I’ll give up on this site until RTC comes back and posts something new. I think he said he would be away for 2 weeks, so possibly a week to go. To be honest, the postings are heading towards dull and uninformed, even The Don has given up.”
Rangers’ Circular Released 21 1034 6709 34 16/6/2011 16:12:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 33 “Lloyd S, maybe the other 26,000 individual Rangers shareholders may want to voice a opinion, perhaps? White has by far and away the biggest shareholding but Dave King and all the small shareholders are still there. I take the point you are making, in the absolute, he owns the majority shares in the Club and all the shares in Group but he would be a brave man if he just ignored all the other shareholders. Defffo my last post.”
Whyte gets ever more mysterious 6 272 7176 22 21/6/2011 8:32:0 OnandOnandOnand 68 1 “DavyLaw, RTC said in another posting that he would be away for 2 weeks with limited access to the site, I think this is his second week away. I agree with your post entirely, just shows the difference between a moderated and an unmoderated site.”
Whyte gets ever more mysterious 6 293 7200 43 21/6/2011 16:44:0 OnandOnandOnand 68 2 “If an ‘insolvency event’ happens, any award made to Bain would be treated like all the rest of the ordinary creditors, except for the relatively miniscule amount the would be preferred under the employee ranking rules. CW can say what he likes if he expects an insolvency event. Draw your own conclusions.”
Whyte gets ever more mysterious 10 484 7393 34 22/6/2011 23:10:0 OnandOnandOnand 68 3 “TBK, I hope Alex Salmond doesn’t catch you quoting English law for a Scottish company such as Rangers, but you may have meant this to relate to Wavetower which is definately an English company. Don’t see how it’s relevant. P12 deals with situations where set off doesn’t apply, why is that ineresting in the context of Rangers?”
Whyte gets ever more mysterious 10 486 7395 36 23/6/2011 0:0:0 OnandOnandOnand 68 4 “JohnBhoy, you posted earlier on here or a previous post casting some light on Whyte’s background and some dodgy Swiss guy but the post was very vague. Given that Whyte has to pass the fit and proper person test, why don’t you go into more detail, we’d all like to hear about that, yes, even Adam.
Can’t fault your logic about the funding route but am a bit suspect as to why they would lend loadsadosh with the tax case unresolved. They haven’t taken any fresh security, maybe they control the bank accounts referred to in the MG05s”
Whyte gets ever more mysterious 10 490 7399 40 23/6/2011 1:28:0 OnandOnandOnand 68 5 “sorry Duggie, was elsewhere. Whyte can’t get Rangers for nothing, buying such a club debt free for about £30m is good business. He will have paid back LloydsTSB, they are out of it, he takes an assignation of their debt. In order to finance the Lloyds debt, he takes a loan from Ticketus, I’m with JohnBhoy there. To be clear, he borrows about £30m-£35m from Ticketus, pays back Lloyds, uses money to upgrade/players to get the the money Rangers owe him up to about £30m, then goes into receivership and sets off (see Johnbhoy post again) the money he is owed against the purchase price. It’s a pretty standard leveraged buyout. He does it because he believes he will be able to sell the shares on in a few years time, he will own Rangers outright, no other shareholders to worry about when he buys from the receiver, no Dave King et al (and no history, that’s another matter).. He may well come a cropper though. If Rangers supporters don’t buy season books, or if the new Rangers have to drop to Div 3, he may well come unstuck. If the Ticketus route is the way he went, he might have personal guarantees to ensure that Ticketus gets paid, no matter what. If Tickeus have done their due diligence on Whyte, they may feel he is worth £30m and so he might not be the man of straw some think”
Whyte gets ever more mysterious 10 492 7401 42 23/6/2011 1:49:0 OnandOnandOnand 68 6 “Duggie, no, he doesn’t care about the HMRC debt, in fact, he welcomes it, gives him the excuse to go into receivership and get all of Rangers. The HMRC debt is a godsend to him. He quite legitimately can blame the previous board for everything as it was, in fact, down to them. He is in a win/win situation, he just had the balls to do it. I wouldn’t. If it goes wrong,I don’t think there is a place he can hide. If it goes right, he will be a hero to some”
Whyte gets ever more mysterious 10 493 7402 43 23/6/2011 1:56:0 OnandOnandOnand 68 7 “I should add that my last posts have been deemed to be 99% crap, so it’s all just a theory.
Except for the 1% non crap”
Whyte gets ever more mysterious 10 496 7405 46 23/6/2011 2:10:0 OnandOnandOnand 68 8 “duggie, HMRC don’t force anything, whyte can appoint a receiver anytime after the decision goes against Rangers. HMRC have no legal grounds to pursue any company, Wavetower or whoever, who buys or offsets the assets.
Is there anyone out there who can address the fit and proper person issue?”
Credit Where Credit Is Due 18 885 8674 35 22/8/2011 22:32:0 OnandOnandOnand 132 1 “Without wishing to lend too much credence to The Accountant (entertaining as his posts may be), there is an office of HMRC at 100 Parliament Street, SW1A which does indeed look out to Westminster Bridge and the Palace of Westminster, deals mostly with international tax clearances and the like, pretty high level stuff……………………..
There are also at least 5 media consultants businesses nearby…….. draw your own conclusions”
Credit Where Credit Is Due 18 890 8679 40 22/8/2011 22:52:0 OnandOnandOnand 132 2 “Don,
As you’ve taken to posting again here, can I have your wise comments on this analysis please.
I think it’s clear that the Lloyds loan was assigned to Wavetower/RFG, the MG05s was a flawed attempt to release a part of the season ticket money to allow that to money be secured elsewhere, the balance of the assets still held under the pre-2003 security.
CW can engineer an insolvency event of his choosing but looking at RTC’s blog piece, I think it inevitable that CW will have to pay at least the small tax bill now with a FTT appeal re the penalties. CW has confirmed publicly that he would pay it. To use this debt as an insolvency event would be a grave mistake. Fans could be sold the idea of Receivership when faced with a £50m debt brought about by the previous board but simply wouldn’t understand why an insolvency event triggered by the recent HMRC collection action would be brought about by such a relatively small debt.
The decision of the major case FTT if adverse will set off the insolvency provisions. A receiver will be appointed, all assets then belonging to RFC will be transferred to RFG in satisfaction of the debt due and CW will then own 100% what is currently Rangers. (no Dave King or pesky shareholders to worry about)
He won’t rush to sell these asets, why would he? I forget what the last net balance sheet assets of Rangers was stated to be but would imagine it would be in the region of £150m (admittedly an inflated sum but it’s amazing what people will believe). He has gained control of these assets for a cost of £20-30m. His net worth has increased by £120m (ignore the insolvency figures, there will be an immediate re-valuation). This isn’t about Rangers, this is about increasing CW’s net worth and thereby extending his borrowing powers for other non football related projects. Men like CW are not focussed on one thing, they have lots of projects and the asset value of one is used to finance ofthers. That’s just business, to borrow a Godfather analogy.
Credit Where Credit Is Due 18 896 8685 46 22/8/2011 23:17:0 OnandOnandOnand 132 3 “Don, at the risk of starting a mutual appreciation society, I think you expounded the Receivership route first, my role was to explain it in simpler terms.”
Credit Where Credit Is Due 18 897 8686 47 22/8/2011 23:23:0 OnandOnandOnand 132 4 “TBK, the answer to your question is 1 and 2, Lord Glennie gives hints in his judgement, sometimes snafu is the reality. I have seen some real howlers prepared by so called legal professionals but the MG05s is right up there at the top. It was rubbish, not deliberate and some trainee has had his/her contract cancelled.”
Credit Where Credit Is Due 19 901 8690 1 23/8/2011 0:21:0 OnandOnandOnand 132 5 “Duggie73
It’s a theory, but I suspect it’s closer to the truth than you may imagine.
Business isn’t pretty but you need to stand above it, sometimes. Why would CW embark on this venture if there wasn’t real profit in it? (not just a mere return on assets). Profit may not come in one business, but in another.
As an aside, I think he will spend money on Rangers, maybe £10-20m, as the Big Two are drawn to the EPL, where real money lies. Check google, when have Celtic recently objected to a transfer to the EPL? Sky want matches that punters will watch, Celtic and Rangers bring the X Factor, not Swansea.
CW will save Rangers from the sins of their fathers if he can keep it going until the FTT rules against him or in favour of him, doesn’t matter. He will keep a hold of Rangers until the day they go to EPL, then he will quadruple his investment. I wish I had thought of it. And all for a pound (sterling, not flesh)”
Credit Where Credit Is Due 19 903 8692 3 23/8/2011 0:51:0 OnandOnandOnand 132 6 “Duggie73
Rangers is a business, just like any other. The point I was trying to make is that funders would aggregate the total value of his assets when deciding to lend to other businesses and buying Rangers would significantly enhance his asset value.
Will Celtic and Rangers, the two being bound together in this instance, ever join the EPL? Time will tell.
I’m sorry if you find this business is model jaw-dropping to you, it has been around since the late 1700’s when canals were a new and exciting business, I don’t mean that in a condesending way, just as a matter of fact. Look at the history of canals and development of train lines as an exeplar, CW is just doing what c(C)apitalism does”
Credit Where Credit Is Due 19 904 8693 4 23/8/2011 0:57:0 OnandOnandOnand 132 7 “exemplar, sorry”
Credit Where Credit Is Due 19 924 8713 24 23/8/2011 11:17:0 OnandOnandOnand 132 8 “Theaccountant @10.45am
Once again, this issue of preferential claims raises its ugly head (‘the Revenue had attempted to have preferential status re-enacted in this case,’). Preferential status was removed by Act of Parliament, the Enterprise Act 2002, how is it to be conferred ‘in this case’ without another Act? If the idea was floated at HMRC, I’m sure it was shot down in flames as being just nonsense and anyone putting up a paper suggesting it would find themselves licking stamps in Milton Keynes. If you are going to throw out red herrings, make them a tad believable.
Oh, and to those who refer to the HMRC handbook which confirms preferential status may be available in some cases, it’s true for cases where insolvency took place pre-September 2003 and the case is not wound up yet. There’s a few of them kicking around but not many.
Finally, on the preference question, the point is often made about employees having a preference. That one is at least true, up to about the first £400 a week for 8 weeks, a material sum to a groundsman but a good night out to some of the overpaid, undertalented ‘stars’ of the club.”
Credit Where Credit Is Due 19 948 8738 48 23/8/2011 16:2:0 OnandOnandOnand 132 9 “Theaccountant @ 3.40
‘some were of the opinion that …………’
Never heard so much balderdash and piffle for years.
I’m sure we all wish you a good day in return, enjoy your vistas, watching vast herds of wildebeests migrate majestically before your window (yet another fantasy view)”
The Craig Whyte disaster: who benefits? 1 5 9683 5 5/9/2011 8:37:0 OnandOnandOnand 4 1 “I thought this site was meant to eschew wild hypothoses and stick to facts.
Seems I was wrong. Never mind, I can read this to my 3 year old, she likes a good fable. I’ll make up the part where the nasty giant steps in and takes back his castle.”
The Craig Whyte disaster: who benefits? 1 13 9691 13 5/9/2011 8:52:0 OnandOnandOnand 4 2 “Or maybe Murray favoured an offer that let him keep his catering outlets and other ways to keep raking in the cash?
Alternatively, there could have been a side deal that Murray gets paid a bonus later. Who knows? We could all speculate in this and other universes but stoking the fires with this level of speculation seems outwith the original purpose of the blog.”
The Craig Whyte disaster: who benefits? 1 26 9704 26 5/9/2011 9:17:0 OnandOnandOnand 4 3 “RTC @ 8.52
There are plenty of facts around about Whyte if you dig a bit deeper, I sent you a post weeks ago which you kept in moderation. Join the dots and win a major prize……
I have never thought Whyte was a genius, a genius would never have touched this poisoned chalice with a bargepole. Chancer? Maybe. He had the ability to see an investment which carried a good security and at worst, he will possibly walk away with his money intact. At best, either if Rankers win the tax case, (not a chance) or he gets all the assets out through Receivership, he will have added to his overall asset value and this gives him leverage for other deals.
I have no doubt he has paid off Lloyds in respect of the club debt. He may have taken that liability into Wavetower (Lloyds are his bankers, after all), backed no doubt by a personal guarantee. He may have funded it elsewhere, again, backed by a PG. The fact that people will lend him money personally suggests they have checked out his creditworthiness and found him good for at least part of the borrowings.
As for Ellis, has anyone seen him at Rangers since the start of the season? Rumour has it that he was at the Chelsea game but as a guest of someone who holds a corporate sponsorship.
RTC, titivating us with references to gossip you’ve heard doesn’t help here, I can get that on the Huddleboard and now, it seems, on FF. Hey, wait, they tell me Whyte has run off to BVI, okay, it’s the middle of the hurricane season but it’s on FF so it must be true.
Come on, you can do better than this”
The Craig Whyte disaster: who benefits? 7 343 10027 43 6/9/2011 0:40:0 OnandOnandOnand 4 4 “geeze, not Occam’s razor again!!!”
The Craig Whyte disaster: who benefits? 7 345 10029 45 6/9/2011 0:46:0 OnandOnandOnand 4 5 “I think slimshady @11.20 got it spot on. Give it a few days, let RTC post after events have unfolded with a more relevant post.”
The Craig Whyte disaster: who benefits? 7 349 10033 49 6/9/2011 0:59:0 OnandOnandOnand 4 6 “Good to see The Don posting tonight……….. has chasing after the grandweans tired you out? I hope not.
As an aside, to clarify a few posts on here and the previous blog, no ‘on the record’ comment can be made on the content of a legal action until the Record has been closed. It becomes a public document only at that point. Speculation as to the pleadings before then could be actionable as they are not the parties’ final position. Could be covered by an informed sources report though. Applies to the Levy & MacRae action, and the MB action.
Second, a small point, but it has been suggested that HMRC can appoint an Administrator. While it may be possible for an ordinary creditor to appoint an administrator, it seldom if ever happens, usually it’s the company or a floating chargeholder who appoint. HMRC can appoint a liquidator, different procedure.
Still the best blog though”
The Craig Whyte disaster: who benefits? 8 352 10036 2 6/9/2011 1:10:0 OnandOnandOnand 4 7 “Ramsey Smith @12.46
I have no idea why but, no section 42 isn’t in force. Must be due to the need to harmonise Scottish and UK legislation
The Craig Whyte disaster: who benefits? 8 353 10037 3 6/9/2011 1:15:0 OnandOnandOnand 4 8 “RTC, I think I may have answered your question to The Don in a round about way. If section 42 isn’t in force, then there is no legal requirement to tell Registrar of Companies about the assignation.
There may be another provision re notification in the CA 2006 but it’s 1.15am and I can’t be airsed researching it…………”
The Craig Whyte disaster: who benefits? 23 1136 10839 36 9/9/2011 16:24:0 OnandOnandOnand 4 9 “droid @4.20pm
Would that be the same David Grier pictured alongside Craig Whyte at the takeover?”
Martin Bain, His lawyers, Rangers & Insolvency 6 278 11296 28 10/9/2011 23:38:0 OnandOnandOnand 96 1 “Could any of the legal beagles on here clarify something? I always understood that it was good practice not to comment on an active court case, civil or criminal for fear of falling foul of the Contempt of Court Act 1981 which is very wide ranging. Schedule 1, section 14 sets out the criteria for a case being ‘active’, thus making the Act applicable in Scottish civil cases. As this extends to not just the closing of the Record but motions and hearings, you can never be sure if it’s safe to comment.
There are postings which suggest that a hearing has been fixed in the Bain case for Tuesday, does that mean the Act comes into play? If it does, I can see why some more experienced journos might not want to comment (the prospect of 2 years or 3 months in the pokey fair concentrates the mind).
At the very least, i would have thought that the person who uploaded what looks like a copy of the original Summons might have problems.
I also suspect that Wee Craigie’s lawyers, or maybe just Archie, will be scouring the golf courses of Edinburgh to find a Judge to grant an interdict to prevent publication, or, worse still, to pull this blog a la Phil. Is this what RTC meant when he referred to the ‘cons’ of this posting?”
Martin Bain, His lawyers, Rangers & Insolvency 6 284 11302 34 10/9/2011 23:51:0 OnandOnandOnand 96 2 “davythelotion @11.50
Thanks for clearing that up, I’ll sleep better tonight”
Martin Bain, His lawyers, Rangers & Insolvency 7 303 11321 3 11/9/2011 1:0:0 OnandOnandOnand 96 3 “mailto:Duggie73@12.22 and 12.34,
Sorry, I am watching a programme on BBC4, got wrapped up in it.
Simple answer is yes, I maintain that CW intended to do the Rangers deal to improve his overall asset value, it’s the only explanation that makes sense But then along came came Malmo and the unthinkable happened. The events of the last few weeks show CW to be a one dimensional muppet and those around him worse than useless. He is way over extended and is now probably contemplating personal bankruptcy as I’m sure personal guarantees will be involved here. Do I wish I had the idea? Not anymore.
He never was a financial genius, just a guy with a large ego. There was an interesting Horizon programme on this week where it was claimed that 40% of all CEOs exhibited the Warrior Gene which could create psychopaths. Is Wee Craigie a psycho?”
Martin Bain, His lawyers, Rangers & Insolvency 7 306 11325 6 11/9/2011 1:8:0 OnandOnandOnand 96 4 “Johnboy @ 12.56
I’m flattered you think I am employed by Media House but as RTC may remember, I was the person who flagged up the MG05s in the first place, can’t see MH wanting that brought up. I also put The Don’s argument about Receivership into a more readily understandable form. Again, hardly the action of a MH hack.
I always thought it was tube, thank you for enlightening me”
Martin Bain, His lawyers, Rangers & Insolvency 7 309 11328 9 11/9/2011 1:16:0 OnandOnandOnand 96 5 “Reilly1926
You got a Johnny 7 Gun???? ya lucky b, I would have sold my soul for one of them.
I did get a Thunderbirds outfit though”
Martin Bain, His lawyers, Rangers & Insolvency 7 311 11330 11 11/9/2011 1:19:0 OnandOnandOnand 96 6 “Oh, just sent a post, went straight to moderation as it contained the hvn word, here is the amended post
You got a Johnny 7 Gun???? ya lucky b, I would have sold my soul for one of them.
I did get a Thvnderbirds outfit though”
Martin Bain, His lawyers, Rangers & Insolvency 7 312 11331 12 11/9/2011 1:21:0 OnandOnandOnand 96 7 “Duggie73
Nope, ’twas I who first flagged up the MG05s, I thought it was odd as it was an 05, not an 01”
Martin Bain, His lawyers, Rangers & Insolvency 7 316 11335 16 11/9/2011 1:38:0 OnandOnandOnand 96 8 “Reilly1926
But which gun did you shoot him with?????
I was watching an episode of Law and Order Criminal Intent, Goram goes into this shop looking for information from the owner of a collectibles shop, he took a Johnny 7 from it’s original packaging as a way of putting pressure on the perp to spill……….. imagine, a Johnny 7 in original condition. I felt the pain of that Christmas when all that awaited me was Virgil Tracy’s outfit, wasn’t even Scott Tracy outfit.
Anyway, I came to fit my Virgil outfit, went on to be a well adjusted non-psycho person, but that lack of a Johhny 7 still gnaws at me. (anyone who isn’t between 52 and 55 won’t have a scoobie wha we’re talking about)”
Martin Bain, His lawyers, Rangers & Insolvency 7 318 11337 18 11/9/2011 1:41:0 OnandOnandOnand 96 9 “Douggie73
It was Horizon on BBC 2 this week, Thursday, I think, well worth a look on the i-player. The first 30 mins are a bit dodgy but gets interesting when the get to the psychopath amongst us stuff”
Martin Bain, His lawyers, Rangers & Insolvency 7 320 11339 20 11/9/2011 1:50:0 OnandOnandOnand 96 10 “Duggie73
Enjoy the footie, quite a few goals.
And I kind of agree with you, I think, about the set of behaviours thing, or maybe not”
Martin Bain, His lawyers, Rangers & Insolvency 7 324 11344 24 11/9/2011 2:4:0 OnandOnandOnand 96 11 “Reilly1926
But, still, it would be worth it to know that you were once the proud owner of a Johnny 7, ffs @ 4 older sisters thought, they know how to nurse their wrath to keep it warm.
Fritz, I had the very same thoughts myself as I watched it 🙂 ”
Martin Bain, His lawyers, Rangers & Insolvency 7 327 11348 27 11/9/2011 2:21:0 OnandOnandOnand 96 12 “Henry
If ‘forcing a blog off the web is a rather crude tactic which is not especially effective. It’s more likely to enhance, rather than undermine, the credibility of its contents when it’s back up and running’ is correct, and I agree it is, then banning the Herald is an act of crass stupidity. I stand by my moron assessment.
I share your astonishment that the Sunday Post is running with this. The momentum is such that Whyte might as well move to Tora Bora now.
As for it being a ‘draft petition’ (interesting phrase), don’t think so. I’m sure it’s a copy of the first Summons (not a petition) which may well have been adjusted in light of the Rangers defence (‘It wisnae me, a big boy did it and ran away’, apologies to a certain St Mirren supporting author) and the pleadings may well be quite different now. Tuesday will be interesting, perhaps endgame”
Martin Bain, His lawyers, Rangers & Insolvency 7 328 11349 28 11/9/2011 2:31:0 OnandOnandOnand 96 13 “Do Media House still act for Rankers? Has their bill been paid? Bet it’s for more than £20k”
Martin Bain, His lawyers, Rangers & Insolvency 7 333 11354 33 11/9/2011 2:53:0 OnandOnandOnand 96 14 “henry,
I don’t think he is anything other that a chancer with the balls to do what no-one associated with Scotland would do.
As an aside, and at the risk of exposing myself to an avid reader of this site, who will understand my thoughts, Wee Craigie is a sociopath, not a psychopath, he really doesn’t care what anyone thinks, it’s just all about him”
Martin Bain, His lawyers, Rangers & Insolvency 7 338 11359 38 11/9/2011 4:56:0 OnandOnandOnand 96 15 “henry Clarson @ 2.53
All noted and agreed. We are dealing with someone who doesn’t care a feck about anyone else”
Martin Bain, His lawyers, Rangers & Insolvency 8 366 11387 16 11/9/2011 11:33:0 OnandOnandOnand 96 16 “Salah al din @5.23
I hate you, now I have to spend the wean’s Christmas money on ebay……
Paulie @10.33 yes we sleep, sometimes, but there’s something of the night about us…… oh, and rugby on the telly 🙂
Have just bought a forrest worth of newspapers, I’m off to read them and promise not to look too closely at some of the pics, Jean/Brenda.”
Martin Bain, His lawyers, Rangers & Insolvency 9 405 11426 5 11/9/2011 13:54:0 OnandOnandOnand 96 17 “Private Land
The MG05s, however inexpertly drafted, suggested to me that they had indeed done a deal to hive off season ticket money. I’m sure PermatanMan will maintain contacts in Ibrox who can confirm what happened and so his lawyers’ use of the phrase ‘It is understood that….’ is a coded way of saying ‘we have an insider who tells us……'”
Martin Bain, His lawyers, Rangers & Insolvency 9 411 11432 11 11/9/2011 14:28:0 OnandOnandOnand 96 18 “Lennon, given the timing of the lodgement of the MG05s, I’m pretty sure the money would have been advanced as part of the deal. You have 21 days to lodge notice of a security with Companies House, from memory, the MG05s was lodged on the last day. That is a pretty clear sign that the season ticket hive off happened. Obviously, it wasn’t all of the season ticket money that was secured, Wee Craigie needs some cash flow to keep things going”
Martin Bain, His lawyers, Rangers & Insolvency 9 415 11436 15 11/9/2011 14:46:0 OnandOnandOnand 96 19 “The Don
I couldn’t even get Thvnderbirds past the autocensor last night, thanks to RTC for moderating it (does RTC ever sleep?)”
Martin Bain, His lawyers, Rangers & Insolvency 13 648 11673 48 12/9/2011 0:13:0 OnandOnandOnand 96 20 “Willie Nelson – Blue Eyes Cryin’ In The Rain
Analysis of the Bain Papers 6 284 12141 34 13/9/2011 14:35:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 1 “The Don,
I came back from a meeting and was scanning the responses. As ever, I read your postings with interest but thought you were mistaken when you said we do not have access to Lord Glennie’s Opinion to allow the register at Companies House to be altered to delete reference to the MG05s. ‘Hah,’ I thought, ‘he must have been at the claret early today, no grandchildren to chase after. I well remember reading Lord Glennie’s opinion on the Scottish Court Website. I’ll go and get the link to send to him’.
But no, not only the MG05s but the Opinion giving rise to this have been deleted from the record. It’s not on the BAILII database either. Could some lawyer on here check Westlaw?
I can see the authority for non-disclosure of the MG05s (although, from my reading of Lord Glennie’s judgement when it was actually available online. It was more to do with removing it as it was a pile of keech) but what is the justification for removing the judgement itself from the public record?
Has it come to this, that justice must now be secret? FTT(T) in private? Judgements removed from the public record? Lord Glennie is highly respected for his impartiality, forensic legal skills and integrity and I’m sure he must have thought there was good reason to take the judgement down but I just can’t think of what reason would justify this. What else?
Did anyone keep a hard copy of the Judgement to be scanned and posted (make sure you make reference to the hvn word but spell it properly so RTC can catch it in moderation and assess wheher or not he wants to post it)”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 6 287 12144 37 13/9/2011 14:51:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 2 “The Don,
I’ve searched by date range, keyword, ‘Glennie’, and judgements by Lord Glennie, it’s gone.
I can assure you, it was posted on the website.”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 6 289 12146 39 13/9/2011 15:12:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 3 “Mark Dickson, my clear recollection at the time was that Lord Glennie allowed the MG05s to be removed as it was not expressive of the intention of the parties (i.e. rubbish). There then followed a discussion about whether documents could be kept from public view due to their commercially sensitive nature. I cannot recall the decision in that respect but events tend to suggest that they can, and the judgements that go with it. I suppose if you think about it, if it was decided that any fresh MG05s could be hiden from public view, then you would have to hide the decision to hide it from public view as to leave the decision in view would be to allow an inferrence that the MG05s existed. Clear?
Sir Humphry Appleby”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 6 298 12155 48 13/9/2011 16:23:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 4 “The Don
This is a link to a copy of the interlocutor of Lord Glennie.
I think all he did of note was to order the MG05s to be removed from the register, nothing about keeping anything from public view
I still don’t know where the judgement is.”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 13 640 12513 40 14/9/2011 16:23:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 5 “That Ian Hepburn blog above is good but misses an essential point. It is all very well to say that sports journalists can’t be expected to have the same degree of insight as business journalists but to my mind, that just shows how lazy most sports journalists are. I was taught many years ago, if you don’t know something, ask questions, find out about it. Sports journalists should be asking their colleagues in the business world to educate them on the finer points of insolvency. No-one expects them to become overnight experts but they should at least understand the difference between administration and liquidation with the likely consequences of each procedure. We all know Chico, Keevans ( a journalist for 50 years, no, really) et al read this blog so come on, after last night’s pathetic excuse of a programme, have a proper debate with some insolvency expert guests, let them spell it out if you cannot, or will not, research and broadcast the issues yourselves. Pandora’s Box has been opened, now it needs open and full discussion. Leave the Rangers and all the rest of the country’s fans in no doubt what the issues are, for Rangers and perhaps for their own club and certainly for Scottish football as a whole, it’s your duty.”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 18 879 12756 29 15/9/2011 12:20:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 6 “Hugh/Paulie,
HMRC and Bain may be going on the premise that CW will wait until the FTT(T) issues its decision after being re-convened in November before pulling the plug. If the Rangers does not go into insolvency until after 60 days from the date of lodging the respective arrestements (and all we know about Bain is that he has Court authority to arrest, not that he’s either done it yet or anything has been caught by it), then their arrestment will be good as the final result won’t be known until DEc/Jan, well outwith the 60 days and they will get the money, broadly speaking.
Their actions, however, may have convinced CW not to wait.”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 21 1036 12921 36 16/9/2011 15:36:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 7 “Tomtom @ 2.58
‘The beauty of this is that at no time do Wavetower actually part with any cash. When the plug gets pulled they get paid off. In the event of administration there is no doubt that a figure of at least £30m could be achieved by selling all the players. Wavetower get paid this, give £18m back to the lenders and pocket the rest. So in less than a year they could probably make themselves around £12m and still own the stadium which they can sell to a.n.other’
If they’re paid off this way, why do they still own the stadium? If they’re paid off, there is no security and the stadium etc would revert to the liquidator/receiver”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 28 1355 13255 5 18/9/2011 11:19:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 8 “Hugh McEwan says:
18/09/2011 at 10:49 am
Hugh, you ask the question that puzzles most people, who would buy Rangers now? It’s a good question and almost to a man/woman, the answer is, no-one. I agree with that analysis.
So why has CW gone down this route. Most people see the Receivership or pre-pack route as a means to him getting his money back. Is that why he has put himself in the firing line, just to get his money back, maybe make a small profit?
He may be shown to be pretty useless at running the club but I don’t think he would go into this in some mad ego trip. If he doesn’t have his own money, he is using other people’s money. I suspect a lot of that will be season ticket money, mortgaged over 4 years (the flawed MG05s gave that game away) but he must have laid out his game plan to those funding the deal.
So, in summary, a club shocked by insolvency, possibly losing key players, an uncertain future, who would buy them? N0-one.
Good, as that was clearly never the CW game plan. He knew the business could not be sold so why do it? It can only be the one one thing left, to get the assets cheaply to use as colateral for other lending to other businesses he owns. What else makes any sense?”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 29 1437 13342 37 19/9/2011 21:6:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 9 “Paulie,
I agree entirely with you that CW is being forced into reacting to situations that are of his making, in the main, due to his incompetence. These situations are a bit of an annoyance to him but will probably not deflect him from his goals.
Can I ask, Paulie, if, considring all that has been posted (of relevance, I mean), you now have a view as to what his pre-planned strategy is/was?”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 30 1453 13361 3 20/9/2011 0:29:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 10 “Paulie @10.46
The thought that there is a consortium out there putting together a bid must give hope to the average Rangers fan who doubts CW, it throws a whole new dimension open to discussion. I must admit, I have always wondered who would buy Rangers as part of CW’s exit strategy of cut and run but if he had banked on a consortium of the loyal rich coming to his aid, he will be relieved to hear the cavalry coming to the rescue. Your inside info has been spot on so far, I await developments with interest.”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 30 1464 13373 14 20/9/2011 9:11:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 11 “Hugh,
I think Paulie’s point was that the wealthy businessmen/women would step in after CW had removed all the ‘baggage’ but perhaps I should let Paulie add to that. Will be interesting to hear any developments on this front.”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 30 1465 13374 15 20/9/2011 9:15:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 12 “Hugh,
I think Paulie’s point was that the wealthy businessmen/women would step in after CW had removed all the baggage but perhaps I should let Paulie add to that. Will be interesting to hear any developments on this front.
Strange, I tried to post this but it just vanished into the ether. Not in moderation either. Oh well, it may turn up later”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 30 1480 13392 30 20/9/2011 13:12:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 13 “Paulie,
Great post, I don’t think I could take issue with any of it but, just to be clear, you are saying that Whyte does the dirty, pulls the plug, takes the assets under the floating charge and sells them on for a quick profit to this band of Rangers-minded businessmen, who then capitalise the business and it’s business as usual at Rangers but with no debt, other than the investment to consortium provides. CW takes a profit of some millions and the consortium then run the Rangers business/club. Is that a fair summary of outcome of your analysis?”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 30 1497 13410 47 20/9/2011 17:3:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 14 “Paulie,
As ever, a good and comprehensive analysis but I am troubled by this idea that Whyte will sell on to a consortium. At what price? Your analysis assumes either that Whyte’s game plan was to sell on all along or that he is being bumped into this strategy by events. To my mind, that would be a very short sighted strategy. If I was a consortium member, what’s my motivation for pitching a price at a level to reward Whyte? I’m going to be the only buyer in town, why pay a premium? I would be better to offer him enough to pay back what he borrowed to buy out Lloyds and, say, a mill for his trouble and tell him to hit the road.
Assuming Whyte has thought that through from day one, why would he do all of this, with all the attendant risks, to put himself in a position where he was over a barrel by this consortium or any other buyer? Does he think there will now be multiple buyers coming forward to push up the price?
Sorry, the idea that he did this just to sell on doesn’t work for me. I’ll stick to the view that he has no intention of selling and has done this to enhance his asset base. Be prepared to have him around for some time to come.”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 31 1507 13420 7 20/9/2011 18:35:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 15 “The Don @ 5.53pm
I understand where you are coming from, kind of, but Hugh is correct to be a bit miffed. I think that there are a few posters on here who have an agenda that is against the spirit of the blog but I would never include Hugh, Ramsay Smith, easyjambo, Adam (we miss you, please come back), the list is a long one. Geeze, I know Duggie73 sometimes seems a bit off the wall and needs to ‘get with the programme’ at times but all of these contributions seem to have led us to a position whereby CW is serious, he will get control of Rangers 100% and will be in the driving seat. I have been on record on here for months that it’s not about Rangers, it’s about business and I think the penny is dropping. If only FF and the other boards could argue with such clarity as the posters on here.
The debate on here has, at times, been worthy of the Roman Senate in its heyday, all hail RTC, Paulie et al for their clear analysis, careful steering when ideas are off track and patience in explaining the finer intricacies. Of course, you are Caesar, my Don”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 31 1509 13422 9 20/9/2011 18:50:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 16 “Paulie
Oft misquoted and taken out of context……….
Friends, Romans, countrymen, lend me your ears;
I come to bury Caesar, not to praise him.
The evil that men do lives after them;
The good is oft interred with their bones;
So let it be with Caesar. The noble Brutus
Hath told you Caesar was ambitious:
If it were so, it was a grievous fault,
And grievously hath Caesar answer’d it.
Here, under leave of Brutus and the rest –
For Brutus is an honourable man;
So are they all, all honourable men –
Come I to speak in Caesar’s funeral.
He was my friend, faithful and just to me:
But Brutus says he was ambitious;
And Brutus is an honourable man.
He hath brought many captives home to Rome
Whose ransoms did the general coffers fill:
Did this in Caesar seem ambitious?
When that the poor have cried, Caesar hath wept:
Ambition should be made of sterner stuff:
Yet Brutus says he was ambitious;
And Brutus is an honourable man.
You all did see that on the Lupercal
I thrice presented him a kingly crown,
Which he did thrice refuse: was this ambition?
Yet Brutus says he was ambitious;
And, sure, he is an honourable man.
I speak not to disprove what Brutus spoke,
But here I am to speak what I do know.
You all did love him once, not without cause:
What cause withholds you then, to mourn for him?
O judgment! thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason. Bear with me;
My heart is in the coffin there with Caesar,
And I must pause till it come back to me
My coat is already on”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 31 1533 13447 33 20/9/2011 21:45:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 17 “Hugh @ 9.25pm
I was told that it was the last day of summing up by Thornhill. Would have finished on 6th May but did not take place for technical reasons, nothing to do with the case itself, but don’t know what that was”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 31 1535 13449 35 20/9/2011 21:48:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 18 “Douggie73
Welcome to the programme!!!”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 31 1540 13454 40 20/9/2011 22:8:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 19 “Hugh @ 9.50pm
I think all evidence had been led, HMRC had finished their submissions on evidence and Thornhill had almost finished his. half a day would have done it but never happened. Given the nature of lawyers, will probably now need a day or two to finish but should be over to the judges to give their decision from November onwards. Others will have a better idea than me as to how long it usually takes for a decision to be issued. Cue the Accountant and his pearls of wisdom?”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 31 1542 13456 42 20/9/2011 22:16:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 20 “Paulie Walnuts @ 9.02pm
Would that make Wee Craigie = Brutus?”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 31 1545 13459 45 20/9/2011 22:22:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 21 “Paulie
Would the events of the last few weeks constitute significant post balance sheet events to be reported in the notes to the accounts? If so, I can envisage the accounts being published at the last possible moment, 31st December 2011. Oh to be a fly on the wall of the Grant Thornton audit department”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 32 1551 13465 1 20/9/2011 22:48:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 22 “Duggie73 @ 10.42
Last point you made, the answer appears to be no, if the Bain Papers are correct. When asked by the board before takeover as to what he would do about the tax bill, Bain claims to say CW would offer £10m- £15m and if not accepted, would ‘let it go’, i.e. allow the company to go into insolvency”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 32 1552 13466 2 20/9/2011 22:51:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 23 “Is it possible that Alastair Johnston reads this and can give us an insight? (Unless he’s Sam/the Accountant).”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 32 1555 13469 5 20/9/2011 23:0:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 24 “Just a thought………
CW does the deed, insolvency, buys from his own receiver by offsetting the price from what he’s owed, gains admission to the SPL, (assume no buyers emerge) all is well……….
But he doesn’t have enough money to keep it going and Rangers go into administration.
Analysis of the Bain Papers 32 1558 13472 8 20/9/2011 23:10:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 25 “Duggie73
I say this as a friend, stay off the whisky, you were on the programme, now way off.”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 32 1564 13478 14 20/9/2011 23:24:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 26 “Hugh @11.10pm
The assumption is that he will swing a deal to keep most but not all of the players and Wavetower/Rangers2011 is the phoenix. It will take a lot of cash to keep the company going. Adam and others did a lot of good work guestimating how much season ticket money would be realised by a ticketus type deal, see postings at the time of the MG05s debacle. If that, combined with the possible amortisation of the catering contract income is not enough to see out the season until new season ticket money comes in, Wavetower/Rangers could go bust unless CW steps in with his wealth to bale them out.
If he has no wealth, would a new administration ensue?
I don’t know. Would the LM Logistics scenario provide a clue? Maybe someone could provide a link to the administrator’s report”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 32 1574 13488 24 21/9/2011 0:3:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 27 “Paulie
I salute you. Your patience with Duggie73 puts you into the sainthood catagory. I have no idea how many times he needs his particular view explained.
Duggie73, do you read the answers to your posts?”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 32 1579 13493 29 21/9/2011 0:22:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 28 “spanglebhoy
What makes you think that we are sectarian Celtic fans? as for silly gloating, you are on the wrong website.
Having said that, I think this blog is done until the FTT(T) gives a decision or until CTW fecks up again. Keep watching the Scottish Courts website for references to Rangers”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 32 1583 13497 33 21/9/2011 0:31:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 29 “Duggie73
It is a complete impossibility, they will make no attempt to pay the big tax bill.”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 35 1714 13641 14 22/9/2011 13:18:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 30 “Captain Bob @12.53
Rangers are the ones bringing the action, this time, they’re not the ones being sued. CQN have it the wrong way round”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 35 1717 13644 17 22/9/2011 13:55:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 31 “Barney @ 1.38, yes the pursuer is listed first
Captain Bob, as this is an ongoing civil action, newspapers are reluctant to write about it for fear of being in contempt of court. I have no idea what it’s about but suggest it might be commissions due to RFC that weren’t paid over. As it’s an ordinary action must be for over…. geeze, I’ve forgotten what the ordinary cause thresh-hold is….. Help me out, someone”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 35 1726 13653 26 22/9/2011 16:6:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 32 “Paul Mac @ 3.17
It’s a Sheriff Court list, Pursuer is listed first.”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 37 1847 13777 47 23/9/2011 0:24:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 33 “Goodness, I go out of a night to entertain a stunning blonde in little black number with unenhanced breasts (that’s me one up on Wee Craigie but sadly, unlike Wee Craigie, mine chose to keep hers out of full view) and I find postings galore. I have to confess to be stunned by Paulie’s inclusion of some Counsel in his list of big hitters, I have given expert evidence in some cases involving those named and Geoffrey Howe’s description of being ‘savaged by a dead sheep’ came to mind.
The Gary Withey angle is interesting. I have no knowledge of his insolvency experience and this link has been posted before
I’m sure he is a first class English lawyer, beyond reproach.
As to the spend on wages, it’s no use relying on what has been said, it’s all smoke and mirrors. There is nothing that can be relied on in any of CW’s statements. What is said to the Takeover Panel should be true and fair, just how many ways has he breached his statement to shareholders since it was given.”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 38 1853 13783 3 23/9/2011 0:34:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 34 “Paulie @12.08
I’m sure CW used Tods Murray to get the MG05S removed, Semple Fraser advised him on the takeover, Harper Mcleod were listed as his lawyers in the roofing suppliers case against one of his companies, how many firms will he use? Has he approached your firm yet?”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 38 1863 13793 13 23/9/2011 0:49:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 35 “Adam 1, all the rest 0
Adam, I admire your persistance in arguing cohesively in the face of adversity, you are indeed a Senator in our Senate (But The Don is still Primus Inter Pares, as he’s older than us, has grandchildren and has a better wine cellar than me, mine being bin ends from Asda)”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 38 1888 13818 38 23/9/2011 8:42:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 36 “Paulie @1.18am
Was one of the three you mentioned. Maybe he was having an off day. I certainly would have felt short changed if I was employing him that day. Couldn’t understand a pretty simple cash flow and his ‘mastery’ of the productions was woeful, I had to tell him which productions he was referring to. Drummond Young was none too pleased, at least 6 heavy sighs……..”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 43 2136 14077 36 26/9/2011 22:9:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 37 “Adam/Paulie/ The Don
I have posted along similar lines before so will be brief.
The whole deal being based on a profit from an insolvency fire sale seems unlikely to me, always has. Doing all of this with the risks involved from all sides (player registrations, finding buyers etc,) and running the risk of having to face the opprobrium of at least part of the fan base for £5m???? He will have spent the thick end of £400k on legal and accountancy fees during the takeover phase.
Doing it for a profit on sale just doesn’t add up to me. If his debt is such that it has to be covered/repaid by the receiver transferring all of the assets, including cash, to Group, then he has Rangers, 100%, no other shareholders to worry about. he then revalues the assets at a going concern level and he is sitting on paper asset values far in excess of an insolvency firesale potential profit.”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 43 2141 14082 41 26/9/2011 22:36:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 38 “Hugh @ 10.09
I think CW will see owning all of the assets as owning Rangers, one and the same thing, despite what others may think. He may be raising capital anywhere in the world, not in Glasgow where everyone reads this blog. You would be amazed at the loans foreign companies will grant. He will be able to get working capital to carry on business with little difficulty.
He has no interest in the other shareholders, the go when he buys the assets. As an aside, what happened to the Dave King visit for a showdown? Much posted about, did it ever happen?”
Analysis of the Bain Papers 43 2144 14085 44 26/9/2011 23:5:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 39 “Hugh @10.51
Why do you think there will be anything left? The receiver will transfer everything he can to Group to settle the debt, including cash (less his fees) and players, the lot. There is nothing left by way of assets for HMRC or ordinary creditors. True, HMRC can bring a liquidation petition to formally wind up Rangers, so could any ordinary creditor but to what purpose? The assets have gone.
Incidentally, just to be clear, the clock is ticking down. Unless CW wants to pay over the £2.3m arrested by HMRC (Why was it not £2.8m, well, Rangers clearly didn’t have any more than £2.3m in their bank account on that day), the 60 day period is well on its way. I’m sure CW hoped he would get a clear run to the FTT(T) decision but HMRC have forced his hand by lodging the arrestment. He will have to appoint a Receiver within the 60 days or lose that cash. Well played HMRC, they know they will not get their money so stuff CW when they can.
The Don, you may well remember back some months when the Receivership idea was first postulated by you. I posted shortly after that to the effect that CW had to spend much more than the £18m he paid Lloyds (no, I don’t believe he got much of a discount, sorry PW) as the scheme to take complete ownership of Rangers needed much more than that. The current thinking that he is increasing the debt daily is spot on”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 2 52 14409 2 30/9/2011 11:2:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 1 “‘………. his public professions of ownership of Rangers would enable the sequestration of Rangers FC should it be discovered that he has been as economical with the facts of his other business dealings as he has about Rangers.’
I’m not sure what the phrase ‘sequestration of Rangers FC ‘ means, in fact I don’t have a clue what it means. The rest of the sentence suggests that RTC may well have knowledge of other business dealings. I think this posting would have been more interesting if these had been forthcoming but perhaps another post is on the way when RTC wants to ratchet up the pressure, or, perhaps, when the Bain case next calls and we find out exactly what documents Bain is asking the Court to force Rangers to produce.”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 11 508 14929 8 3/10/2011 21:33:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 2 “TBK @ 9.18
Which Stock Market rules do you think have been broken by Rangers plc? Wavetower isn’t listed so can’t have broken such rules. Are Rangers not listed on the lightly regulated PLUS market?
Paulie @ 9.13
The HMRC arrestement is in execution and so I think it does get a preference if no insolvency within 60 days of the arrestment. It’s the Bain arrestment that is in a grey area as it is only on the dependence. I enjoyed your explanation of the assignation of the debt, well written and clear. I hope it does not induce some readers to believe that Wavetower must then have paid only 80% of the Lloyds debt.”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 11 515 14936 15 3/10/2011 22:9:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 3 “TBK @9.57
I take that point but I don’t think there is any obligation to notify the PLUS marketor FSA etc if you re-finance. In effect, the assignation of the Lloyds debt is just that, it swaps one creditor for another, Rangers still owe the same money.
Or do they?
If there were no changes to the terms of the debt, I think there could be no objection from an insolvency point of view. As Paulie has pointed out, it is easy enough to create a ‘default’ to allow default interest to be payable and that can be eyewateringly high. Rangers would have to pay that if they defaulted to Lloyds and the same applies to Wavetower.
If, however, the terms of the loan itself have been changed to allow other sums to be lumped into the security, I can see circumstances where not just the receiver would challenge this (he/she wouldn’t, that’s biting the hand that feeds you) but a creditor may be able to challenge such a change. I say ‘may’ as I haven’t researched the point exactly but the actual calculation of claims is done under the rules of the Bankruptcy (Scotland) Act 1985 which does allow creditor challenge. Might not be all plain sailing for Wavetower if they have changed the terms of the loan since they took it over”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 11 516 14937 16 3/10/2011 22:19:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 4 “Paulie @ 10.03
I remember when it was St Claire & Drummond Young, when the first edition came out………. not politic now that DY is His Lordship
I take your point about Receiverships being distinct from liquidations. My instinct tells me it will be redundant as the ‘insolvency event’ will intervene”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 11 521 14942 21 3/10/2011 22:37:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 5 “TBK @10.19
I’m not sure what conclusive proof would satisfy you, apart from sight of a bank statement showing a nil balance on Rangers Lloyds bank statement. CW made a very clear statement following a requirement of the Takeover Panel, to the effect that the debt to Lloyds had been assigned to Wavetower. The Lloyds bank statement will read £0.00 due, the Wavetower account will read £18,000,000 due. If CW has, in effect, lied to the Takeover Panel, as in your view and that of others on here, he is playing a very dangerous game, a game he doesn’t need to play. he would be mad not to pay Lloyds and secure the value of the pre-2003 security.
Yes, the financial statements would help but I don’t see them coming anytime soon. At the very least, I think Grant Thornton will be having a ‘discussion’ with CW and his Board (who are they?) about true and fair view.”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 11 524 14945 24 3/10/2011 22:49:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 6 “easyJambo @10.40
I have read that many times too.
I’m a bit behind the times regarding arrestments since the BAD Act (Bankruptcy and Diligence Act 2007) came partly into force. I really should read it in more depth but these days, I employ very reasonably priced solicitors to advise me on that. It’s a nightmare of an Act, seems to become law at different times for different parts. If it had all been in force last May, the assignation of the security would have had to be registered at Companies House.”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 11 526 14947 26 3/10/2011 22:53:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 7 “Paulie @10.45
Exactly. What PI cover do they have?? Anyone relying on the published accounts and then extending credit to Rangers may have a claim.
Would the smart thing in their circumstances be to resign?”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 11 528 14949 28 3/10/2011 23:0:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 8 “droid @10.52
I don’t think MB will take up his option at 62pps given the current price of mid 20pps
It didn’t figure in the writ posted online in the ‘Bain Papers'”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 11 529 14950 29 3/10/2011 23:4:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 9 “Duggie73
My initial reaction was to say ‘try harder’……….
Go back and read the announcement in June to shareholders.
There won’t be ‘side letters’ or back letters, no way in hell would CW take this on without getting his hands, however it’s worked, on the pre-2003 security”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 11 532 14953 32 3/10/2011 23:22:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 10 “Paulie @11.07
Thanks for clarifying that, I think. Does that mean that HMRC may well indeed get a preference for their arrestment if the insolvency event is more than 14 weeks after its execution?
Why does receivership this side of Christmas not make sense?
I agree that if the tax is due, admitted and has been undertaken to be paid (Duggie73, he says so in the Takeover Panel undertaking statement as I’m sure you know as you’ve now read it), it should be paid”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 11 539 14960 39 3/10/2011 23:49:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 11 “Paulie @ 11.40
You make assumptions as to his goal, all predicated on a sale. At the risk of sounding like Duggie73, what if the obvious is not the goal? What if he just wants to own it all? Get rid of the pesky shareholders?
He should go now with the ‘insolvency event'”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 11 540 14961 40 3/10/2011 23:57:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 12 “Might be my final post of the night but, Paulie, re my earlier posting, does your answer of 11.07 mean that HMRC will get a preference?”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 11 542 14963 42 3/10/2011 23:57:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 13 “I wish The Don was still here………”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 11 546 14967 46 4/10/2011 0:14:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 14 “Hugh @ 11.57
Harsh? Unfair? I would struggle to find another like Duggie73 who promotes such obfuscation of the issues by posting stream of consciousness ideas that he thinks might be true until someone proves otherwise, prove the unproveable.
Patronising? i will admit to that charge”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 13 621 15046 21 4/10/2011 22:19:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 15 “Where did this idea come from that Lloyds would assign the debt to Wavetower without being paid?”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 13 634 15059 34 4/10/2011 23:3:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 16 “RTC
What ‘creative’ action do you think would be open to HMRC if as you say, Rangers are seen to escape? After Vodafone et al, see Private Eyes passim, do you really think, nationally, that anyone cares or is it just a matter for us Scottish football armchair pundits?
A deposit for VAT is a cert, what else? Or does being ‘creative’ mean, almost by definition, that they haven’t thought of it yet? My dealings with HMRC would suggest they don’t have much else in their armoury but I’m sure others on here will have ideas.”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 13 638 15063 38 4/10/2011 23:8:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 17 “Hugh @ 10.52
If Whyte goes down the Receivership route, there is no subsequent administration. It goes, Receivership, then liquidation of the rump that’s left.
Administration goes……. Administration, creditors paid, company survives,………. or administration, CVA, accepted, company survives…………. or administration, CVA fails, liquidation”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 13 642 15067 42 4/10/2011 23:24:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 18 “Hugh@ 11.14
It’s usually the receiver who petitions for the liquidation and gets himsel/herself appointed as liquidator to finalise matters”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 14 651 15076 1 4/10/2011 23:54:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 19 “Cautious Dave
Assets don’t have to be sold to third parties, they can be transferred to Wavetower in satisfaction of the Wavetower debt. You can bet that the value of the Wavetower debt will be the assets. I’m not sure CW has had enough time to inflate the Wavetower debt yet but the arrestments may well have forced him to change his gameplan.
As for the ability of HMRC to block UEFA competitions, don’t see that happening. They have no standing to object, it’s a football matter. You could argue that if a final dividend hasn’t been paid by march 2012, there will be a tax debt but Rangers 2011 will argue that the claim for HMRC has been agreed and they are merely waiting for a dividend.
Perhaps this is one of the ‘creative’ routes RTC was referring to”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 14 670 15095 20 5/10/2011 9:44:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 20 “Easyjambo @12.52
HMRC pursue debt by way of liquidation, not administration. It’s possible but hughly unusual for an ordinary creditor to petition for administration, I’ve never heard of it and it would be very difficult to convince a court that it should be granted. You would have to show the court that there was some purpose which Administration would achieve over liquidation and creditors don’t have enough knowledge of the financial affairs of the company tomake this work, certainly not HMRC. Administrations are initiated by the company through its directors or by a floating charge creditor under the power contained in the floating charge.
Why did HMRC arrest? No idea but it is fair to assume they reasoned that season ticket money would be in the bank. The cost of an arrestment is not much. They would not know if Rangers would go into insolvency but at little cost, arrestment might be seen as a good option. In my view, it has focused CW’s mind on taking action earlier than he would have liked.
It is common for a creditor to appoint a liquidator where a Receiver has been appointed. The liquidator then overviews matters to preserve the interests of the ordinary creditors, so the theory goes. In practice, the Receiver takes all the decisions.
Just to be clear, I don’t expect the receiver to run Rangers for any length of time. It’s quite possible the sale will be agreed and signed up to overnight, i.e. appoint at 5pm, sell at 9am next day. All the work will have been done in advance and the formal appointment is a rubber stamp. How it will all work out with SPL, SFA, player registrations etc is entirely another matter.”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 14 675 15100 25 5/10/2011 10:13:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 21 “Paulie Walnuts @ 10.04
I, too, concur except that I don’t think, and never have thought that this was an asset stripping exercise, it’s a smash and grab, get the assets for the lowest price then hold them to speculate.
Hugh @ 9.49
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 14 678 15103 28 5/10/2011 10:19:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 22 “tomtom@ 9.44
You assume the deal is being done in Scotland. Why? The principal solicitor is in London, CW is based in London, the Receiver may well be from London…………”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 14 680 15105 30 5/10/2011 10:23:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 23 “Hugh @ 10.19
Excellent list, wish I could answer just one of them but as they say, Ah huvnae a scoobie
Maybe ask Mr Romanov what he thinks about 5 and 6, might not be what CW wants to hear”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 14 681 15106 31 5/10/2011 10:29:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 24 “AWOTN @10.22
Thanks for that, I wasn’t aware that an administrator had been appointed, good point. I had read it in the papers, of course, but journalists use the terms liquidation and administration interchangeably without understanding the differences and so I tend just to ignore them and think ‘insolvency event’
That information could be very useful to kick out HMRC liquidation petitions, if they do it for football clubs, why not in all cases. A good few lawyers reading this might thank you for your observation.
I’m off for a haircut. My barber appreciates the wee Rangers tip he gets, the girl who sweeps up gets a half Rangers”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 16 792 15218 42 5/10/2011 21:14:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 25 “Jonnybhoy @ 8.52
I concur. I don’t think he’ll sell on either, not for a while. Get used to Wee Craigie on Only An Excuse for a few years, Jonathon Watson could have a hoot doing him.
Don’t know how he deals with SPL membership though, much better qualified posters on here to answer that one”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 16 798 15224 48 5/10/2011 21:38:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 26 “Kenny @ 9.32
Once again, I concur”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 17 807 15233 7 5/10/2011 21:59:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 27 “Spangles, be afraid. I hope you like horses, well, their heads………..
The Don is miffed”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 17 822 15248 22 5/10/2011 22:39:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 28 “Hugh,
And in Family Trusts………… wait, what kind of ‘Family’ are we talking of here?
Don, do you know this soldier?”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 17 829 15255 29 5/10/2011 23:7:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 29 “The Don,
He’s not a soldier, he’s cafone”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 20 973 15406 23 6/10/2011 22:20:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 30 “Paulie,
Your source suggests that CW will take the newco on (actually, it will be Wavetower) and run it with a view to making a profit. I have to agree and have been saying so for some time. This was never an asset strip, doesn’t make any sense that way unless you had a buyer locked in, highly unlikely.
So we can be clear, CW will ramp up the debt to Wavetower while writing down the asset value of everything in Rangers, including players, to breakup, looking for a point where there is balance, debt = assets. he then appoints a receiver who in turn transfers the assets to extinguish the debt. Wavetower then owns all of the assets and trades on as The Rangers Group, or Rangers for short (he will buy the rights to the name from the receiver to avoid any prohibited names problems) and will then revalue the assets upwards to raise more capital to see the season out.
CW will own all of Rangers and will use its revised asset revalue as collateral.
That’s the theory, I still need someone to tell me how Wavetower plays in the SPL”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 20 990 15423 40 6/10/2011 23:22:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 31 “Duggie73
It’s not just a bit risky, it’s about the riskiest deal I’ve ever seen attempted, so many variables over which he has no direct conrtol, not least player attitude and SPL admission. I’m not even sure he will have a manager at the end of it.
The receiver acts for Wavetower. All aspects of the deal will have been gone over in detail in advance. I don’t think he/she will run the club unless it’s Bryan Jackson………. aye, well……. don’t see Bryan touching it with a bargepole.
It wouldn’t surprise me to hear that break-up valuations were obtained during due diligence and so the basis of low valuations will all be in place.
There is guidance that assets should be exposed to the market for sale, indeed, there is case law on that but I’ll leave that for the lawyers to explain. I do not think, however, that there is an absolute obligation to expose to sale, allowing for a quick deal.
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 20 996 15430 46 6/10/2011 23:36:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 32 “Duggie73
I have no idea if that is correct. I assume Wavetower will be taking an assignation of Rangers’ rights to the contracts, almost creating a TUPE situation, but without seeing the contracts and fully admitting to a lack of knowledge of the rules of the SPL etc, can’t answer that. I have been involved in a hostile takeover where it proved not possible for practical reasons to hold onto key employees, despite having watertight contracts which allowed for assignation. Amazing how many colds they had.”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 20 998 15432 48 6/10/2011 23:42:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 33 “Tsk, tsk, Tomtom, they don’t live in the shadows, they live under the radar………”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 21 1001 15435 1 6/10/2011 23:51:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 34 “The Don
You only have to look at the rapacious chages MHG charge for raising funds to see how easy this is. 10% arrangement fee for the loan to pay off Lloyds = £1.8m Facility fees on loan @ 5% =£900k, refund of due diligence fees, £500k………….. it will go on and on and on and on…”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 21 1015 15449 15 7/10/2011 0:41:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 35 “Cautious Dave,
I think I said that I have no idea how SPL membership is maintained.
As for writing down values, it’s just a matter of opinion to an extent and professional advice. If I were carrying out due diligence, I would ask for going concern and break up valuation from my valuers. I would then switch between the two as necessary, break up re insolvency practitioner, going concern re my gnomes of Zurich”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 21 1017 15451 17 7/10/2011 0:49:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 36 “TBK
If only it could be decided by the courts……..
Tony Deutsch at Glasgow would go through them like a dose of salts but, sadly, will not be.
If I have proved my worth to you, I would hope for advancement in the family. It’s a pity your daughters are married, have you any other female relatives I could ‘associate ‘ with?”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 21 1021 15455 21 7/10/2011 1:15:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 37 “Ray Charles
‘Take these chains from my heart and set me free…’ It might work for Wee Craigie, he may be the saviour of the spirit of Rangers, the heart transplant surgeon who plucks the heart from the fading company and inserts it into the new Wavetower.
I’ll go with the Kaiser Chiefs……… ‘I Predict a Riot’
As an aside, Wee Craigie, unless he is a billionaire, will have given personal guarantees for the loan he took to pay off Lloyds. This may all go tits up personally for him, goodbye castle, goodbye Bentley, goodbye girlfriend with plastic appeal”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 21 1026 15460 26 7/10/2011 1:40:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 38 “Paulie,
How does he rip the cash and run? What cash? The £2.3m? How does he take that? The cash he stashed with his lawyers? It’s still Rangers cash.
Tell me what he can take at this point before receivership/administration.”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 21 1028 15462 28 7/10/2011 1:55:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 39 “About rangerstaxcase
I have information on Rangers’ tax case, and I will use this blog to provide the details of what Rangers FC have done, why it was illegal, and what the implications are for one of the largest football clubs in Britain
If the FTT does not proceed or if it proceeds as unopposed, when can we expect your evidence?
RTC, your last few postings seem to contain a tacit acceptance that it will be insolvency law (loopholes, as you assert) and not tax law (your area of expertise and intelligence) which will decide the Rangers tax issue. When will we hear your revalations?”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 21 1031 15465 31 7/10/2011 2:11:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 40 “Ray Charles
‘ I can’t stop loving you………..’
What mysterious past has CW? He racked up debt, waited in Monaco until the heat died, came back and has fecked up every UK company he has been a director of.
I accept that he may be an investor and not a director, so there may be many under the radar investments, but which financial guru would call a press conference to talk down the company by £10m the day before his company is in court with insolvency as a live issue”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 21 1047 15481 47 7/10/2011 9:56:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 41 “Paulie
I don’t think he’ll sell straight away but there may well be an exit route for the ‘cleaned up’ Rangerslite once the next season ticket sales are known.. If they hold up to a substantial degree, he will get a decent price and a handsome return on his £22m outlay, £18m loan and £4m overdraft to Lloyds (the rest just being paper transactions, no real cash).
Finally, Paulie, it’s Wavetower, not newco, he won’t move the assets out of Wavetower just yet, there might be tax to pay on such a transfer and we all know just how much CW loves paying tax”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 22 1067 15501 17 7/10/2011 12:19:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 42 “Hugh @ 11.51
The security deposit angle is interesting but I think it misses the point.
HMRC have had the power since 1992 to demand a VAT deposit in certain circumstances. It can be used where a company goes into liquidation/insolvency owing a significant amount of VAT and a newco is set up with common shareholders and directors to carry on the business. They are now using this power commonly and well. Problem is, they have to show some delinquency in VAT payments on the part of the insolvent company. Has anyone got any evidence that Rangers are not paying their VAT? Unless there has been non-payment, I don’t think HMRC can demand a deposit and if they do, will undoubtably be subject to an appeal by Wavetower.”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 22 1068 15502 18 7/10/2011 12:21:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 43 “High,
Sorry, should have added that the PAYE rules don’t come in until 12th April 2012 and the insolvency event will have happened long before then”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 22 1071 15505 21 7/10/2011 13:2:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 44 “Liam @ 12.32
You may well be correct, I was just basing my view on the experiences I’ve had where a VAT deposit was sought. I haven’t come across a case where PAYE liability was factored in, despite the company in liquidation owing, in one case, over £100k”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 34 1683 16148 33 11/10/2011 21:54:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 45 “RTC,
Having just come in from the pub after watching the defeat to a magnificent Spanish side, I was wondering just how much I had consumed when I read the comments today. I’m sorry that you have decided to stop posting meantime but your determination to continue the blog is commendable. There are people here with agendas that, either wittingly or unwittingly, serve to seed confusion and blur the arguments. I also take a hint of disappointment in your last few postings. You now understand that Whyte has an agenda that never took the FTT seriously and has pursued his own path regardless of how inept, crass, greedy, immoral and downright stupid that path is.
The blog was put up by you to discuss the implications of the FTT and when concluded, you wished to share the evidence that had come out. I’m sure it was damning but it may never see the light of day unless you publish after the insolvency event. I hope you do.
As for Craig Whyte being pursued to the point of sequestration, it might happen, who knows, but as Liberty is a BVI company, and Liberty owns Wavetower, the link will never be made. HMRC may well launch an investigation into companies connected with Whyte, personal reputations will be tarnished, residences in Monaco will be taken up again, but I doubt this will have an effect on whatever company comes to be known as Rangers.”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 39 1915 16404 15 13/10/2011 10:36:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 46 “Hugh and The Don
Before 9mm pistols are brandished and many horses die, could I just confirm that, in the old days, receivers, who had disposed of all the assets, then put the company into liquidation and asked for early dissolution in terms of Section 204 of the Insolvency Act 1986, all at minimal cost. It’s just the way things were done where all the assets had been disposed of.”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 39 1919 16409 19 13/10/2011 10:54:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 47 “As for why CW is doing all of this, there was a programme on 5 Live last night about the influence of American owners in the EPL and the way they have leveraged the clubs they have bought. Far too many points to comment on here but worth a listen to give a flavour of the CW strategy. (and yes, I know, EPL is far above the SPL but the principles are the same, only on a much smaller scale). The comments on the Man U float being only an exercise to establish true worth are especially interesting.
Follow this link to the podcast
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 39 1923 16413 23 13/10/2011 11:12:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 48 “The Don
I bow to your eidetic memory. I would be hard pressed to remember what I said two days ago, never mind May/June.
For the sake of completeness, were you referring to my posts as being ‘dull… and uninformed’ or those of others? The posts between you and Hugh are certainly not dull…..”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 39 1932 16422 32 13/10/2011 13:15:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 49 “http://news.stv.tv/scotland/west-central/274539-rangers-director-donald-mcintyre-sues-club-for-300000/”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 39 1936 16426 36 13/10/2011 14:2:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 50 “Mark Dickson, I’m told they weren’t represented as the continuation for a week had been agreed in advance. They will be there next week.
The Don, your interest in Dave Harnett’s dealings with Goldman Sachs will be furthered by reading page 29 of this issue Private Eye (sorry, not able to copy/paste, you will have to splash out £1.50 from your retirement fund to purchase the esteemed organ)”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 40 1981 16471 31 13/10/2011 19:54:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 51 “Paulie Walnuts
I can see that the Share Purchase Agreement might have clauses linking it to the assignation of the Lloyds loan but surely the ‘insolvency event’ will come from a default on the loan provisions, not a breach of the SPA? If Wee Craigie has signed up to an SPA that would lock him out of calling up the loan, I would be astonished”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 40 1983 16473 33 13/10/2011 20:0:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 52 “Stephen @ 7.41
Re end of careers, borrow a copy of The Don’s Private Eye from today, still on page 29
Melanie Dawes, director of business tax during the Vodafone affair and who approved the deal with Hartnett, has just been promoted to run the Cabinet Office’s economic and domestic affairs secretariat, reporting directly to David Cameron……”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 40 1990 16480 40 13/10/2011 20:39:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 53 “Paulie and RTC
If SDM is indeed looking at enforcement of the SPA, might he not be better off looking at the Warranties?
Warranties are kind of like statements that such and such is correct, such as, for example, that Wee Craigie has x amount of cash at hand. Warranties are often guaranteed personally. If Wee Craigie has given such personal guarantees, and has breached the warranty by having, for example, £16.90 in the bank and expired Green Shield Stamps to his name, he may end up with financial obligations which he cannot meet and be forced into bankruptcy, unless he is indeed the fabled billionaire.
Using failure to meet warranties would give SDM a strong say in what happens re The Grand Craigie Plan.
RTC, you may well yet get your wish for sequestration”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 41 2014 16504 14 14/10/2011 0:41:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 54 “The Don
Maybe you were right to point out my previous post in May/June………..
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 41 2038 16529 38 14/10/2011 12:35:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 55 “Hugh @11.39
Can I put another possible explanation of the CW plan to you. Suppose going concern in its present form was only ever an incidental consideration? He would have loved to have CL money and probably didn’t expect Rangers to be dumped out. CL money would have given him the liquidity he needed to keep the club going to allow the debt to Wavetower to ramp up. Far from Wavetower not charging interest, it will be charging eyewateringly high rates and management charges so that when the bubble bursts, it is owed more than the assets are worth on a break-up basis. Wavetower then gets the assets to settle its debt. I still haven’t seen anything to convince me that wavetower/Rangers gets to play in the SPL.
By doing it this way, CW/Wavetower become 100% owners of a private limited company and this allows him to do a Glazer
Paul Mac @ 12.07
He won’t walk away, he’ll be here for some time, perhaps long enough to be SCW, the lamb is roasting as we speak”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 42 2069 16560 19 14/10/2011 14:18:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 56 “Mark Dickson,
I don’t deny there may be reasons why CW would go for administration (SDM putting him under pressure for one) but administration really doesn’t suit CW. An administrator acts for all the creditors, not just CW/Wavetower and he couldn’t be certain of getting Rangers at the end. Receivership gives him all of the assets in a company he owns 100%. I’m sure the Don will quote me on this later……. There will be no administration and no CVA”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 42 2078 16569 28 14/10/2011 14:51:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 57 “I have to take my leave of you now for a while, no doubt to the relief of some.
My message to the Rangers lurkers on here concerning Craig Whyte……
He’s not the Messiah, He’s a very naughty boy”
Craig Whyte’s Confessions: A Critical Analysis 42 2080 16571 30 14/10/2011 14:57:0 OnandOnandOnand 31 58 “Hugh,
May the farce go with you”
The Wee Tax Bill: a scam explored 25 1232 18175 32 22/10/2011 13:13:0 OnandOnandOnand 175 1 “RTC,
I won’t repeat comment on the most recent posting on Paul McConville’s website as it looks like subtle disinformation. Any thoughts?”
The Wee Tax Bill: a scam explored 30 1490 18436 40 23/10/2011 19:39:0 OnandOnandOnand 175 2 “AWOTN @ 7.25
If the administrator accepted an HMRC claim of £24m (ignoring the small tax case), that would mean that there would have to be £100m of debt, 75% of it voting for CW. I’m sure he’s good at ramping up debt, but not that good. CVA just can’t work on that basis.”
The Wee Tax Bill: a scam explored 30 1494 18440 44 23/10/2011 20:10:0 OnandOnandOnand 175 3 “TBK @ 8.08pm
Are previous disqualifications taken into account when a court determines the length of disqualification? I ask that in the abstract, of course, I have no particular director in mind, and besides, I haven’t seen that documentary, honest”
The Wee Tax Bill: a scam explored 31 1505 18451 5 23/10/2011 20:59:0 OnandOnandOnand 175 4 “The Don
I raise my glass of Fiano to you as I retire to watch Spooks”
The Wee Tax Bill: a scam explored 31 1519 18465 19 23/10/2011 22:12:0 OnandOnandOnand 175 5 “AWOTN
I don’t disagree with you on much of what you say and I’m sure you’ve probably forgotten more about administration than I will ever know but my problem is that, tactically, administration surrenders to control and gives rise to an exit route, the CVA, which he can’t win as HMRC will control at least £25m of voting power. The administrator acts for all creditors. CW would only have done this if he knew he would have maximum control. I tip my hat to HMRC as their arrestment of the small tax case money probably screwed up CW’s timetable royally and encoraged others to go to the arrestment table.
These deals are never a one shot hit. He will have borrowed, say, £22m He will pay off Lloyds and have enough in reserve to pay off Hearts and the rest as an inducement to allowing Wavetower into the SPL. It is reported that Bain’s Counsel claims CW is no stranger to inducements.
In my view, he will ramp up the debt to him, reduce the asset value to break up, appoint a Receiver, take the assets in exchange for debt leaving nothing in Rangers, call an emergency meeting of SPL with his Wavetower chequebook open to pay off any outstandings. He trhen owns Rangers 100% (how does he keep his promise to ‘look after’ the small shareholders, maybe gives then equivalent non-voting ‘B’ shares in Wavetower), re-values the assets and can borrow even more a la Glazers.
Brave man if that is his plan, so much can go wrong with that”
The Wee Tax Bill: a scam explored 31 1520 18466 20 23/10/2011 22:23:0 OnandOnandOnand 175 6 “an afterthought
To those who say he will do all of the above to sell on the assets, who will he sell to? The market is a tough place. Let’s say a group of Rangers minded businessmen get together and make an offer, what would they bid? If I were one of the consortium, I would urge that we pay him his cost plus, say, a million for his trouble, why would I want to pay more? I’m pretty sure we would be the only ones stepping up to the plate, we would want to drive a hard bargain. Come to think of it, cost plus £1 seems much fairer.
Sale of the assets is unlikely to be his goal.”
The Wee Tax Bill: a scam explored 31 1523 18471 23 23/10/2011 22:30:0 OnandOnandOnand 175 7 “AWOTN
Yep, all fair points. It could be administration with a hive down and no CVA, just keep the administration going until Wavetower are admitted by hook or by that other word. I’m off to read the new post.”
The Wee Tax Bill: a scam explored 31 1530 18491 30 23/10/2011 22:48:0 OnandOnandOnand 175 8 “AWOTN and gunnerb
See my post at 10.23. I would love it if you could shoot my logic down, I’m not precious.
TBK, where is the cash at bank since April 2011 figure?”
The Wee Tax Bill: a scam explored 31 1535 18498 35 23/10/2011 23:2:0 OnandOnandOnand 175 9 “How much did Whyte pay for Castle Grant? I note the fixed assets figure is kind of strange, a round £750,000 in 2009, I seem to remeber that’s what he paid for the ancestral pile (sorry, not his ancestors, of course)”
The Wee Tax Bill: a scam explored 31 1537 18503 37 23/10/2011 23:9:0 OnandOnandOnand 175 10 “Paulie Walnuts,
AWOTN makes good points about administration and if you ignore the CVA aspect (It just will never work, guys) then he gets up to a year to run the administration, more than time enough to get SPL rules changed, possible Carter Rucking if they don’t…………
The Don, that might work as opposed to receivership. As AWOTN says, the administrator could do the same job and hive down. The admin route would also be good for PR as he has made the bears aware that this could happen
There may be a problem with the prescribed part though (section 176A of the Insolvency Act for the anoraks)”
The Wee Tax Bill: a scam explored 31 1542 18514 42 23/10/2011 23:20:0 OnandOnandOnand 175 11 “Gunnerb/greengrass
It’s true that Lloyds are one of CW’s banking connections but I doubt they would give him the money. The world is a small place these days and there are plenty of people out there with other people’s money to invest and who aren’t too particular who they lend it to, as long as they earn a commission. Don’t trouble these guys for less than £20m-£30m at a time though.
Ask me to find you £20m, no problem, ask me to find you £200k, go away………”
The Wee Tax Bill: a scam explored 31 1543 18516 43 23/10/2011 23:23:0 OnandOnandOnand 175 12 “See, AWOTN, told you that you were my admin guru…….
EJ, I was looking at the fixed asset figure for 2009, is £750,000”
The Wee Tax Bill: a scam explored 31 1546 18521 46 23/10/2011 23:34:0 OnandOnandOnand 175 13 “gunnerb
I think a fool with an inflated ego and a complete misunderstanding of what is involved. The plan looks good on paper, just wait until the tumbleweed rolls through an empty Ibrox”
The Wee Tax Bill: a scam explored 31 1548 18529 48 23/10/2011 23:56:0 OnandOnandOnand 175 14 “AWOTN
I may have partaken of too much Sicilian wine, of course, if CW goes down the admin route, he will do so as a board decision (easy to do now) and won’t use his security as grounds for appointment, he won’t have power to appoint an administrator under his pre 2003 security, he will just keep that waiting in the wings to collect on”
The Wee Tax Bill: a scam explored 32 1551 18536 1 24/10/2011 0:16:0 OnandOnandOnand 175 15 “but if the holder appoints an administrator, does that give rise to section 176A problems? Probably a moot point as everyone is on another posting or gone to sleep……….. One for the anoraks
Pity, the conversation was getting interesting, I thought Easyjambo’s posting of the Tixway UK accounts was interesting. Is Cw’s only visible source of wealth to be a castle and some debtors? Is the castle worth £5m as the press report when it seems to be in the books at just over £1m?”
The Wee Tax Bill: a scam explored 32 1553 18538 3 24/10/2011 0:24:0 OnandOnandOnand 175 16 “pity, we could have had easyjambo post the Merchant Corporate Recovery accounts, last ones, make interesting reading
well, when read with the report of the administrator of LM Logistics group, the guy in the documentary which I haven’t seen, honest”
The Wee Tax Bill: a scam explored 32 1558 18578 8 24/10/2011 8:6:0 OnandOnandOnand 175 17 “Easyjambo @1.12am
Thanks for that.
Can you see anything in the accounts, signed off in 2011, that the loans to LM Logistics were lost? LM went down in August/Sept and the Administrator’s report was in November 2010, signed off by Mr Death, I kid you not, he has the best name ever for an IP. I agree that the loss is post balance sheet date but is a significant post balance sheet event and I would have expected to see a note to that effect. Is someone being less than open and frank?
What would that do to the balance sheet?”
Disinformation and Deceit 1 4 18476 4 23/10/2011 22:38:0 OnandOnandOnand 4 1 “he started posting on 29th March 2011???? Hmmmmm interesting. I heard a story that Whyte was meant to conclude with SDM around then but the Independant Duffers (No Surrender Division) put a stop to it”
Disinformation and Deceit 1 7 18480 7 23/10/2011 22:40:0 OnandOnandOnand 4 2 “Oi, wait a minute, Mr RTC, bone to pick with you, if it was so easy for you to trace the IP address to names, you must have known that Rasputin was Sam was The Accountant, etc……..
I’m guessing you just didn’t want to spoil our fun”
Disinformation and Deceit 1 17 18494 17 23/10/2011 22:54:0 OnandOnandOnand 4 3 “RTC
Let them come, one and all. The trolls are found out quickly enough. Free speech has its price but restricting who can post here shouldn’t be an option. You put more than enough time into this already”
Disinformation and Deceit 1 22 18505 22 23/10/2011 23:12:0 OnandOnandOnand 4 4 “The Don,
If you’re on here, we need you on the previous post comments, some points made that could do with your input”
Disinformation and Deceit 1 44 18544 44 24/10/2011 0:37:0 OnandOnandOnand 4 5 “Jonnybhoy,
It’s just arithmetical. How much debt = 75% of whatever HMRC and anyone else opposed to the CVA vote. If £25m is the HMRC and other debt, then the debt to vote against it is £75m, £100m-25% =£75m”
Disinformation and Deceit 1 45 18545 45 24/10/2011 0:39:0 OnandOnandOnand 4 6 “RTC, could it be Bothwell…………..”
Disinformation and Deceit 2 80 18584 30 24/10/2011 9:11:0 OnandOnandOnand 4 7 “Easyjambo
Did you get a chance to reflect on the point I made about MCR accounts in the comments to the last blog, the wee tax case? Your thoughts and those of any auditors on here would be appreciated”
Disinformation and Deceit 2 86 18590 36 24/10/2011 10:23:0 OnandOnandOnand 4 8 “EJ @ 10.11
Actually, the point is that he knew that LM was a loss to the fund of about £600k, a total loss per the administrator’s report but the notes do not disclose this”
Rangers Insolvency: Is it inevitable? 3 125 18976 25 25/10/2011 14:1:0 OnandOnandOnand 65 1 “Geoff @ 1.38pm
Strange………. Companies House usually use the phrase ‘proposal to strike off’, not ‘active to strike off’
Have you been to Specsavers recently?”
Rangers Insolvency: Is it inevitable? 3 133 18984 33 25/10/2011 14:7:0 OnandOnandOnand 65 2 “Re new companies being formed.
Don’t get too worked up about this. Any punter can set up a company, just go online and pay your dosh. If the name you choose is available, then it will be registered. I suspect this is just someone chancing their arm, setting up companies with ‘Rangers’ in their name in the hope that some billionaire will buy them for a few quid.
Check out the addresses, it’s also the home of Gaselectric Renewals and Sita Wastecare, absolutely no connection to Wavetower/CW”
Rangers Insolvency: Is it inevitable? 3 144 18995 44 25/10/2011 14:29:0 OnandOnandOnand 65 3 “AT @ 2.22
If they use the name, I agree but the companies will probably just sit on the shelf in the hope that someone buys them. If we all chip in a quid, could make him an offer or The Don could send a soldier to parlez with him”
Rangers Cash Flow: A Huge Problem 16 766 20110 16 28/10/2011 14:15:0 OnandOnandOnand 155 1 “‘I felt a great disturbance in the Force… as if millions of voices suddenly cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced. I fear something terrible has happened. You’d better get on with your exercises.'”
Rangers Cash Flow: A Huge Problem 25 1223 20579 23 30/10/2011 12:48:0 OnandOnandOnand 155 2 “Can the Big Brains amongst the posters on here have a stab at answering the question posed by RTC in the last 2 paragraphs of this posting? I think the question has been ignored or lost in the morass of tripe posted yesterday (yes, Andy, I mean you) but it would be a good point to take up and do what this blog does best, analyse, debate and conclude.
I’m off out now, will be back in a few hours, I expect to see answers when I come back, I’m sure you will have shone light on the enigma that is Wee Craigie.”
Rangers Cash Flow: A Huge Problem 25 1224 20580 24 30/10/2011 12:52:0 OnandOnandOnand 155 3 “‘Once you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, no matter how improbable, must be the truth.’
â€• Arthur Conan Doyle”
Rangers Cash Flow: A Huge Problem 27 1325 20686 25 30/10/2011 21:22:0 OnandOnandOnand 155 4 “so………………
The theories are A) it’s a cunning plan by Lloyds,cfDouggie 73, or B) there’s a mysterious buyer who put Wee Craigie in as a front man to do the dirty work and who will then step out of the shadows the proclaim himself the Messiah, sending Wee Craigie off to Monaco with a suitcase full of dosh.
He’s not the Messiah, he’s a very naughty boy (got that one in twice and, yes,Hugh, I appreciate that it was said by a fictional character).
Not convinced by either but readilyadmit that both are possible.
Anyone got other theories? We are helping RTC here, it was he who first posed the question.”
Rangers Cash Flow: A Huge Problem 27 1332 20693 32 30/10/2011 21:33:0 OnandOnandOnand 155 5 “Hugh,
I take it that you don’t subscribe to the mystery backer theory then, it’s just CW getting in over his head and being overtaken by events? Probably the most sensible interpretation. But the question was, why did he do it in the first place?”
Rangers Cash Flow: A Huge Problem 27 1337 20698 37 30/10/2011 21:41:0 OnandOnandOnand 155 6 “TBK,
RTC is Craig Whyte…….. machiavellian, but I like it!! So that’s where he got the spreadsheet from
Almost as machiavellian as Kip Kane’s posting, nice one Sam”
Rangers Cash Flow: A Huge Problem 27 1339 20700 39 30/10/2011 21:45:0 OnandOnandOnand 155 7 “PL @ 9.36
Yes, I take that point but it was very brave of CW to take all of this on without a buyer at hand, if sale was his plan. Besides, as I have posted before, why would this new buyer pay much more than CW paid? Business is a tough cookie, if you’re the seller and I’m the only buyer, I’m going to drive your price down. For your version to make sense, CW would have had to bet on there being several bidders to push the price up. In the SPL, I don’t see that as likely”
Rangers Cash Flow: A Huge Problem 27 1340 20701 40 30/10/2011 21:48:0 OnandOnandOnand 155 8 “Mark D @ 9.37
It’s quite common for newcos to pay off some of the essential creditors of oldco, happens all the time. It can be very difficult for newcos to trade if they don’t do some deals with previous suppliers.”
Rangers Cash Flow: A Huge Problem 27 1346 20707 46 30/10/2011 21:58:0 OnandOnandOnand 155 9 “TBK @9.51pm
‘Perhaps it is just a case of the Whyte Knight, insolvency specialist, venture capitalist,……
‘it does exactly what is says on the tin!’ (armour in this case’
Let’s hit this one on the head. Can we stop repeating the hype about Wee Craigie. ‘Insolvency specialist’????? Since when? Specialist at bailing out and leaving creditors high and dry. Show me one, just one, successful turnaround. ‘venture capitalist’? yes he invests in businesses but just looks like paper promises in most cases, where’s the beef?
Oh, I forgot, they’re all under the radar. I’m off to watch The Sting again, can’t face the football highlights”
Rangers Cash Flow: A Huge Problem 27 1350 20711 50 30/10/2011 22:4:0 OnandOnandOnand 155 10 “Jimbo @ 9.58pm
CW has spent the last month preparing the fans for administration, why wait? If he has to put money in, it can only be justified if he needs more debt to justify taking the assets in lieu of cash to repay his loan. Why would he do this? RTC and Jim McGinley have valued the assets at £12m tops, I can see Wee Craigie printing that post out and saying to his annointed IP ‘don’t bother with professional valuations, we’ll just use the RTC figure, despite it being 99% crap'”
Rangers Cash Flow: A Huge Problem 28 1358 20719 8 30/10/2011 22:21:0 OnandOnandOnand 155 11 “TBK
Just type ‘irony’ after the post, sings ‘any old irony, any old irony, any, any any old irony’ (shows his age)”
Rangers Cash Flow: A Huge Problem 28 1361 20722 11 30/10/2011 22:28:0 OnandOnandOnand 155 12 “PL, sorry, I don’t understand the last paragraph.
Are you saying that Rangers are worth £40m just now, that is what the administrator should get? He/she then pays CW his bunce out of that? I don’t get the bit about a debt free Rangers being worth the same as Celtic, sorry. For Rangers to be debt free, CW has to pay the wee tax bil and the rest, win the big tax case and have Wavetower write off its debt. How will any of that happen?”
Rangers Cash Flow: A Huge Problem 28 1367 20729 17 30/10/2011 22:37:0 OnandOnandOnand 155 13 “I think someone should check CW’s social diary and see if he’s had lunch/succulent lamb with Dave Hartnett at HMRC.
Is the pic on KDS of tomorrow’s back page of the Daily Ranger a spoof? My irony mode is set to ‘off'”
Rangers Cash Flow: A Huge Problem 28 1375 20737 25 30/10/2011 22:43:0 OnandOnandOnand 155 14 “TBK @ 10.22
While I don’t want to legitimise Sam’s latest postings, the Tribunal is made up of a panel so there will be more than 1 member, although might only be one judge member
Rangers Cash Flow: A Huge Problem 28 1382 20745 32 30/10/2011 22:48:0 OnandOnandOnand 155 15 “Medals seized? That would suggest that the agent had a decree against Rangers, served a charge for payment and then carried out an attachment of the medals, like an old style poinding. I’m surprised no-one heard that Rangers had a decree against them. might even buy the DR to read about this one”
Rangers Cash Flow: A Huge Problem 28 1383 20747 33 30/10/2011 22:52:0 OnandOnandOnand 155 16 “TBK,
Baldrick, sorry for spoiling your cunning plan, I now see the wavelength you operate on, I will be aware from now on and try not to interfere with your troll outing.
As Hugh says, chapeau”
Rangers Cash Flow: A Huge Problem 29 1408 20773 8 30/10/2011 23:24:0 OnandOnandOnand 155 17 “Duggie @ 11.13
Good points, but to be clear, Wavetower will get permission from the IP to use the name Rangers as part of the deal, so ‘Rangers’ name will live on”
Rangers Cash Flow: A Huge Problem 29 1413 20778 13 30/10/2011 23:29:0 OnandOnandOnand 155 18 “Duggie,
If you are having trouble sleeping, read this re use of company names
Just to be clear, the rules were changed as suggested, so nothing to stop the name being used, it’s not a prohibited name if you buy rights to it from an IP”
Rangers Cash Flow: A Huge Problem 29 1417 20782 17 30/10/2011 23:33:0 OnandOnandOnand 155 19 “Paulsatim.
Funnily enough, I don’t know much about Farsley Celtic, apart from what you get on a google search and we all know that’s 99% crap.
Maybe The Don has a view on this, where are you, my Don? Are you the mysterious backer, waiting with the family wealth?”
Rangers Cash Flow: A Huge Problem 29 1429 20794 29 30/10/2011 23:53:0 OnandOnandOnand 155 20 “Paulsatim @ 11.37
What does that have to do with HMRC allegedly blocking the use of the name ‘Celtic’?
I have to confess I think I was the person who cast doubt on the ability to vary the terms of the Floating Charge post assignation. At the very least, might give a creditor, such as HMRC, the right to object to the sum allowed by administrator or receiver under the charge”
Rangers Cash Flow: A Huge Problem 29 1436 20802 36 31/10/2011 0:14:0 OnandOnandOnand 155 21 “Paulsatim
Just a point of information. When CVAs, admin pre-packs and the like became more common, HMRC set up a dedicated centre to deal with the proposals of IPs. This then followed the usual civil service logic as follows :-
we are here to deal with CVAs
the more we accept and have to monitor, the bigger our department will become
the bigger our department comes, the more important we become
we want to be important
so accept CVAs
It might surprise you to know that, outside football, CVAs and admin orders aren’t that hard to get approved by HMRC. It’s just the football creditors’ rule that hacks them off as football creditors, at least in Engerlund, are expected to be paid first”
Rangers Cash Flow: A Huge Problem 29 1442 20808 42 31/10/2011 0:31:0 OnandOnandOnand 155 22 “Iain mcg @12.23am
Why would an assignation be registered? What is the basis of the legal requirement to do so, given that Part 2 of the BAD Act isn’t in force yet?”
Rangers Cash Flow: A Huge Problem 29 1444 20810 44 31/10/2011 0:47:0 OnandOnandOnand 155 23 “Paul McConville @ 12 20 something
Which is it? Receivership or Administration? You tied yourself in knots in that article, they are 2 different and distinct regimes but you have mixed them up. I don’t mean to be disparaging but your article seems based on a more academic analysis with very little hands on experience. Your article is more than a little misleading. SIP 16 is guidance, nothing more, and the extensive case law you cite is relevant only to administrations, not receiverships
Rangers Cash Flow: A Huge Problem 29 1448 20814 48 31/10/2011 0:54:0 OnandOnandOnand 155 24 “iain mcg
I refer to the Bankruptcy and Diligence (Scotland) Act 2007 and the fact that you don’t recognise this speaks volumes, I ask again, where is the legal authority for the proposition that assignations of floating charges MUST be registered?
Och, I suppose it doesn’t matter, it will all come to pass, in due course.”
Rangers Cash Flow: A Huge Problem 30 1453 20828 3 31/10/2011 1:16:0 OnandOnandOnand 155 25 “Paul McConville
I don’t think I’ve ever seen an administration following a receivership, liquidation, yes.
I read the Insolvency Act, no wait, the Insolvency Rules, even better, before bed every night, better than sleeping tablets for getting you over. I suggested that to Duggie 73 earlier, he hasn’t posted much so must be fast asleep.
Goodnight all, may Morpheous embrace you all and lead you to your heart’s desires”
The Devil Is In The Details 1 23 20845 23 31/10/2011 2:4:0 OnandOnandOnand 10 1 “RTC
So the deal is
we meet up and pool our resources ( I can kick in £42.40 from my scratchcard winnings)
we use the winnings to go and see SDM and get an assignation of his rights under the agreement as he just wants to see the back of it all
we pay him £1 for his rights
we use the remaining £41.40 to buy Dave Hartnett a good Mcdees
He okays a CVA with a promise of an ‘introduction’ to CW’s ‘friend’ at the last old firm game (did she really have two half footballs stuffed in her dress)
we own Rangers
Oh, fatal flaw……….. we own rangers”
The Devil Is In The Details 1 30 20852 30 31/10/2011 2:19:0 OnandOnandOnand 10 2 “Why would Rangers playing in Division 3 and working their way up be bad for CW? He can pretty well control his costs to make a profit, or at least no loss, while they come back to SPL. Euro football is off the agenda for 3 years anyway, unless the widow’s son can appeal to them too.
He will take a long view, if his costs are reduced, so is his risk. Rangers will come back stronger, without the high cost base and he will own it all.
Feck the supporters, they will come back, he only needs 10,000 hard core to meet his costs and he’ll get that”
The Devil Is In The Details 2 99 20926 49 31/10/2011 12:6:0 OnandOnandOnand 10 3 “No, I didn’t buy a copy of the DR, I borrowed one. Glad I didn’t pay them the 40p to read the verbage by JT on page 50, 25 points a season over 3 seasons, a candidate for Torquemada’s stupidest person on the planet award. I know CW is preparing the support for the worst but this really is going too far”
Promises Promises 1 30 21257 30 1/11/2011 7:51:0 OnandOnandOnand 20 1 “RTC @ 7.35
The suspension of Bain, so soon after the takeover, shown Whyte’s attitude to the SPA and his clear understanding that SDM would do nothing on breach. The words are there as a formality, everyone concerned with this knew that Whyte would be given a free hand”
Promises Promises 1 34 21261 34 1/11/2011 7:57:0 OnandOnandOnand 20 2 “AWOTN @ 7.48
Lord Hodge’s view on Rangers’ insolvency relied on FTT(T) returning an adverse decision. Until, the decision, I don’t think you can expect him to infer immediate insolvency sufficient to warrant the appointment of a provisional liquidator to hold things meantime”
Promises Promises 1 40 21267 40 1/11/2011 8:12:0 OnandOnandOnand 20 3 “I’m guessing Paulie will know the identity of the party who has allegedly lodged a Petition for liquidation, Courts open soon………..
Anyway, off to work, am in Aberdeen today so a bit of a drive, I suspect I’ll be pulling over a few times to check for messages on here”
Promises Promises 1 42 21269 42 1/11/2011 8:20:0 OnandOnandOnand 20 4 “FFS, RTC, don’t compliment me on that, the proper acronym was first posted by the Accountant and I am not he, honest, the vista from my office is somewhat different”
Promises Promises 4 173 21406 23 1/11/2011 16:46:0 OnandOnandOnand 20 5 “Did anything ever come of the suggestion that there was going to be a change to the floating charge lodged with Companies House?”
Borrow Borrow 1 34 21678 34 2/11/2011 15:33:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 1 “Been posted a few times on other postings and sites but the Close connection is Mr Betts
look at the sponsors of the business at the bottom of the homepage.
Not cheap finance at all, as Brogan Rogan confirms
Re dubcentral, the case reference is for a Commercial Action so not a liquidation as they start with an ‘L’ reference”
Borrow Borrow 1 41 21686 41 2/11/2011 15:48:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 2 “Ottokaiser
Read the case studies, they did a really good job for LM Logistics……. oh, no, wait, errr, maybe they don’t know about the Administration of LM by, wait for it, Close Invoice Finance. It’s a small world after all”
Borrow Borrow 4 191 21838 41 2/11/2011 22:3:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 3 “Paul McConville
I assume this is an HMRC petition to wind up Hearts, given Paul Johnston, Solicitor to Advocate General, is listed as the presenter”
Borrow Borrow 5 224 21871 24 2/11/2011 22:51:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 4 “I see Wee Craigie was in court again today for the One Stop case against Tixway UK
Sheriff Ross’ roll, item 5
He likes his litigation, doesn’t he, The Don retired too early. He could have acted for One Stop and smacked Harper Macleod down again. Don’t suppose we’ll know what happened today, case managements are confidential, so I believe”
Borrow Borrow 5 243 21891 43 2/11/2011 23:15:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 5 “steve-b @ 10.16
Interesting question, why do you ask? Is it in relation to Wee Craigie and Liberty’s loan notes in Merchant House?”
Borrow Borrow 5 249 21897 49 2/11/2011 23:27:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 6 “Paulie Walnuts @ 11.18
Re the 14 week/98 days, that time limit becomes absolute UNLESS an objection is lodged to interrupt it. Given CW’s love of litigation, do you think he might not just object? Have to confess my knowledge on this bit is sketchy, I sound like a Scottish journalist on this one, I’m just too lazy to look it up”
Borrow Borrow 5 250 21898 50 2/11/2011 23:31:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 7 “droid
my antivirus software keeps finding malware on that site, they may be having a problem with all on here logging in”
Borrow Borrow 6 274 21924 24 3/11/2011 0:5:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 8 “Steve-b asked what convertible loan notes were in an earlier comment. I think this is worthy of some explanation as it relates to CW’s investment in Merchant House Group.
In 2009, the markets were in meltdown. MHG was in trouble, there had been 2 petitions for its liquidation (source London Gazette) and it was in deep financial trouble. Although a very small company in London terms, it had a subsidiary, Merchant Capital, which was FSA registered. This allowed MHG to raise money from the public for investment schemes.
CW, through Liberty, put cash into MHG as a loan to restore its liquidity. At a stroke, he then had access to a mechanism for raising money from the public. He made a loan to MHG through Liberty and then got the right to have that loan repaid, not by cash, but by shares.
It’s confusing to look at the numbers, they all relate to fractions of a penny, perhaps easier to discuss in round numbers. He has the right to take shares at 5 a share. In September this year, when results were issued, the shares were trading as high as 29 but had been kicking around the 17 mark before that.
It works like this, for every £ of loan he gets repaid, he gets 20 shares. If the price is, say 20, he gets 4x his money back ( 4 x 5), when 15, he gets 3x his money back (3 x 5). Now the clever part. Liberty also has the option to repay the loan back. Let’s say he converts £10k of loan and gets £40k for the shares. He can then repay £10k to restore his loan to where it was and trouser the £30k remaining. He is back to where he was in loan terms but has £30k in his pocket.
This works well as long as the price is above 10. You need at least 11 to make it work, otherwise you sell shares and don’t make a profit to restore the loan
If you look at the disclosed share dealings on the Interactive Investor site, that’s exactlty what he did until the share price skidded at 10. At that level, all he can do is take his profit. If he cashes in 10,000 and gets 20,000, no point in repaying his loan as that would result in no profit. Sell 10, get 20, profit 10 but repay the original 10, result is 0.
Interestingly, the trade involving WillowTrading was a zero profit trade. Why transfer them to Willow? Obvious answer, he had previously borrowed the money from Willow and this was repayment. All the signs of a man with no money.
Final point. If you dig deep into the documents, it wasn’t just a loan from Liberty. Tixway UK also guaranteed financial obligations. That’s the same Tixway that was in court today for not paying a £90k debt, but I’m sure there is a sound defence to that.”
Borrow Borrow 6 276 21926 26 3/11/2011 0:11:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 9 “Paulie Walnuts
Any thoughts on my objection to the arrestment theory?”
Borrow Borrow 6 282 21933 32 3/11/2011 0:32:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 10 “Thanks Paulie. I was thinking about timescales, an objection would buy him a few months. fecked if I know why he needs it though”
Borrow Borrow 6 284 21935 34 3/11/2011 0:38:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 11 “My Lordship,
Pritchards Stockbrokers are also guaranteed by Tixway UK, according to their last accounts. Sorry, I don’t have the tech experience to post them.
Pritchards are FSA registered, as Private Eye have noted in their last issue. Could we have a whole different ending to this saga, courtesy of our financial regulators? (don’t hold your breath)”
Borrow Borrow 6 290 21943 40 3/11/2011 0:55:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 12 “Goosy
The fixed charge is just for the catering income, not all the assets.”
Borrow Borrow 6 296 21950 46 3/11/2011 1:11:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 13 “MDC @ 1am
Don’t know anything about car parking, do you pay for parking at Castle Greyskull?
As for the rest, Wee Craigie might have enough to keep him going for now. he will have tucked a good wad under the blanket from the Ticketus season ticket sales, see RTC postings in May/June, a bit here, a bit there, more than enough to get him through to whenever……
I just don’t know why he doesn’t pull the plug, what reason to carry on and keep putting money in? And, as I’m on record many times, how doRangers stay in the SPL???”
Borrow Borrow 6 298 21952 48 3/11/2011 1:19:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 14 “EasyJambo
If you are a shareholder, just one is enough, you might have a legal title to ask Bryan Jackson to go in as Administrator, he and Donnie McGruther seem to be the football administrators of choice, I suspect both of them will consider a request”
Borrow Borrow 6 300 21954 50 3/11/2011 1:31:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 15 “MDCC
Might be a shock to some posters but I’m of the ‘Adam’ hue, my heart sank when I heard that WeeCraigie was bidding, I knew from the start where this would end. My postings have been a warning as to where CW will take my (almost defunct) club.
I have seen CWs, they are sociopaths, (see earlier postings)”
Borrow Borrow 7 321 21977 21 3/11/2011 9:34:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 16 “Thanks to those who have posted following my self outing, I doubt The Don will speak to me again, omerta having been broken. I had this vision last night of RTC calling together all of the posters on here after the big event and Adam surrounded by Hugh, Knights, Walnuts, Jean (whatever happened to Brenda?), My Lord Wobbly, The Real Lord being The Don (would he ever sully a hostelry), Mark, Mark McConville and Brogan, that’s a fine name for a firm of solicitors, geeze, a whole pub full of gloating posters and only Adam to put an opposing view. I have assumed that EasyJambo has retired to his scratcher by then (incidentally, I think EJ was and is and will be one of the most helpful posters on here), and to all I have not named, it’s only because I’m an old duffer and names elude me. I couldn’t leave Adam by himself, although watching Hugh and Adam exchange blows would be fun.
RTC has it in his power to call such a meeting, he alone has all of our email addresses. I know who two of the posters are (Jim, aka Brogan etc, putting your name up is a bit of a giveaway, maybe too much ‘guitar playing’ had been going on there) but would be fascinated to know who the others are.
Mark @ 8.59, Ellis has nothing to do with it, he’s been told to feck off. he turned up at the Chelsea game as a guest of a Chelsea member and they all but tazered him to keep him away.”
Borrow Borrow 7 326 21982 26 3/11/2011 9:59:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 17 “V
Ermmm, yes, point taken
Not sure who I will have to support next year. Safe to say, none of my friends of the Blue Hue bought season tickets this year, they were well warned.
I think Scottish football may be at a crossroads. Supporters of all teams are fed up with the mediocre dross being served up, maybe all of the teams, the SPL, should go into administration en masse. As a condition of coming out of admin, no foreign players can be signed for 10 years. I look at what Falkirk are doing to produce young players and salute them. I grew up in an age where Scottish footballers could hold their own with the best of the world. Young players are now seen as assets to be sold off as soon as they have value. None of the kids where I live play football in the street, despite there being few cars. When I was a boy, a football or tennis ball was always with me, school playtimes were 47 v 32ish football in the playground, no girls though, sorry jean and Brenda, and summer holidays were 7 a side in the park with jumpers for goalposts. Just don’t see that anymore.”
Borrow Borrow 7 330 21986 30 3/11/2011 10:7:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 18 “mark @ 9.55
Not aware of Ellis being linked to Close, that link is firmly with Phil Betts. Keep going back to this but LM Logistics is the touchstone. Whyte and Betts were directors, Close Invoice were the funders. maybe someone (EJ) will put the administrator’s report up on here, tells the full story. It shows how the company failed but also highlights the way CW and his directors are less than truthfull when they report glowing Merchant Corporate results in Jan 11 when they know by then that the LM investment is lost. Mark Daly could have asked that guy from LM many more questions, perhaps documentary 2 is in planning”
Borrow Borrow 7 333 21989 33 3/11/2011 10:10:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 19 “mark @ 10.06
I was that boy.
And he was my dad, sadly missed but, yes, half cut most nights”
Borrow Borrow 7 335 21991 35 3/11/2011 10:15:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 20 “tomtom
As I understand it, Ellis introduced CW to the deal following his first go at Rangers but was quickly found out to be a wa**ker and told to feck off. My source for this is an ex Rangers director who questioned CW about the Ellis connection. Before anyone asks, my source has revealed very little else, other than what has been posted here.”
Borrow Borrow 7 342 21998 42 3/11/2011 10:23:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 21 “NTHM
Me too, with you all the way.
Rangers should be in Division bottom, win their way back to the top again, as they will and can be supported once again. What went on with EBTs was just plain wrong and gave an advantage re signing players. I agree with Auldheid, so do a good many Rangers fans but the vast majority won’t see it like that unless it is made clear to them by being dumped down to the bottom.
Incidentally, do you have to fail your IQ test before Clyde will let you on to their phone in? Where do they get those numpties from?”
Borrow Borrow 8 355 22013 5 3/11/2011 10:53:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 22 “BRTH,
I think we discussed my guitar, a Tanglewood, at Heathrow a few years back.
Hope that restores the identity advantage. Anyway, it’s as much as you’re getting 🙂 ”
Borrow Borrow 8 393 22055 43 3/11/2011 12:46:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 23 “Gwared
The smell of Vick still brings back the memories
I know we’re off topic but shared memories bring us closer together. My first Rangers game was away to Falkirk at Brockville when we were gubbed, I think, couldn’t pay much attention to the game as I was being peed on, ah, those were the days”
Borrow Borrow 8 397 22059 47 3/11/2011 12:48:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 24 “Ralgex??? we couldn’t afford that and deep heat was for my mother’s bad back”
Borrow Borrow 8 400 22062 50 3/11/2011 12:55:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 25 “leather ball with rubber insert in my time, had to coat with dubbin to keep the wet out, never worked and the ball lasted about 30 minutes before you had to pump it up again. Headering that was like headering breezeblock”
Borrow Borrow 9 401 22063 1 3/11/2011 12:58:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 26 “on the subject of headering leather balls, why was it always the bit with the laces that caught your forehead? 20 guys came off the pitch with scar marks on their heads”
Borrow Borrow 9 409 22072 9 3/11/2011 13:12:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 27 “Brenda,
Jean’s no here so we will behave like schoolboys with a supply teacher”
Borrow Borrow 9 417 22080 17 3/11/2011 13:20:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 28 “Better go and get some work done, thanks guys, a great wee trip down memory lane and loads of laughs”
Borrow Borrow 10 461 22124 11 3/11/2011 15:44:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 29 “Andy @ 3.41
I think it was posted elsewhere that £500k had been paid to account. It could also be that was all that was in the bank at that time. This explains why there seems to be little in the bank account now, most of it will be salted away in England, out of reach of an arrestment, and brought back in as and when needed”
Borrow Borrow 10 466 22129 16 3/11/2011 15:57:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 30 “Sannabhoy
Did they get a time to pay at £500k a month? pay June, miss July and August and woosh, arrestment follows”
Borrow Borrow 10 467 22130 17 3/11/2011 15:59:0 OnandOnandOnand 21 31 “tomtom
It has always been my view that he should pay the small bill, contest the penalty if he likes, but the obligation to pay was clearly undertaken”
Confidence Trick 1 21 22419 21 5/11/2011 9:10:0 OnandOnandOnand 12 1 “RTC
I assume the full document is a briefing note for the incoming owner. As the SPA was concluded on 5th/6th May, we would have to assume it was prepared after that date. If so, then the person who prepared it seems to be not very good at his/her job as no reference is made to the late April/early May proceedings. The wording is also unclear. It refers to an Opinion obtained in February, then goes on to use the words ‘at this time’. At what time? If it was the time of the Opinion, surely it would have been ‘that’ time? If it was the time of the briefing note was prepared, i.e. after the April/May hearing, it suggests that there is a considerable degree of confidence in some success being achieved although, as you point out, that may relate as much to SDM’s prospects of success as that of Rangers.
Another interpretation may be that the document was a briefing note prepared in April as part of due diligence but before the latest hearing.
Clearly, the date of the document is crucial.
I’m not at all surprised that Bryan Jackson was brought in to advise re wrongful trading. I suspect his involvement has long ceased”
Confidence Trick 1 25 22423 25 5/11/2011 9:20:0 OnandOnandOnand 12 2 “RTC
I wouldn’t expect you to confirm or deny that Bain or McIntyre produced this document but not sure who else in the immediate post takeover setup would be in a position to report. Does sound a bit like a cover yer airse note
Anyway, without seeing the context of that paragraph and the rest of the document, it would be idle speculation on this blog’s part.
The Bain Papers Part II?”
Confidence Trick 1 30 22428 30 5/11/2011 9:32:0 OnandOnandOnand 12 3 “RTC @ 9.25am
Point taken and noted. However, the phrase ‘that there are very definately reasonable prospects of success’, being in quotation marks, suggests it is a quote of the advice from Counsel. I think we can speculate as to the meaning of those words.
Having read more than a few Opinions, the words very definately seem redundant, there are either good, reasonable or poor prospects of success. ‘Very definately’ makes the’ reasonable’ seem more than better than evens when in fact it’s just reasonable.”
Confidence Trick 1 32 22430 32 5/11/2011 9:39:0 OnandOnandOnand 12 4 “Odear @ 9.25am
I have been on record for some time as saying this takeover is not about immediate profit but getting assets on the cheap. Mark Dickson’s post realises that profit on a liquidation sale isn’t likely to be the aim here. Timing is everything in business and they way events have run away fro CW suggests his timing has been knocked off, I think he’ll wait until after the hearings have taken place this month, then throw in the towel immediately after, blaming the old board and MIH for mismanagement of the case, nothing to do with him, after all”
Confidence Trick 2 73 22471 23 5/11/2011 11:29:0 OnandOnandOnand 12 5 “RTC @ 11.18am
CW announced his interest on 19 November, he might have some involvement just prior to that. Wavetower wasn’t incorporated until September 2010. Wavetower is just the vehicle for purchase”
Confidence Trick 2 80 22478 30 5/11/2011 11:40:0 OnandOnandOnand 12 6 “I commented earlier that CW might just throw in the towel after the hearing and before a decision, blaming all the old parties, as he has never had any intention of paying the bill. That might suit HMRC as well. If the hearing concludes, the decision will be issued regardless of Rangers’ financial status and a favourable decision for them will give them the stick they need to beat others with.
Is anyone hearing anything from Grant Thornton about the progress of the audit. Accounts have to be lodged before 30th November for Rangers to remain on the Plus market. Are Grant Thornton doing any work on this? Would love to see the ‘going concern’ comments”
Confidence Trick 5 239 22647 39 5/11/2011 23:15:0 OnandOnandOnand 12 7 “tomtom @2.15pm
I think between your 2 postings, you have more or less hit the nail on the head. totmtom goes a long way to explaining CW’s strategy but overstates his involvement in the April/May sessions of the Tribunal. if this stv posting is correct,
then Whyte was ready to do the deal in late March when he had the agreement of Lloyds and SDM. I think this explains why Whyte and Betts come on as directors of Wavetower in mid March.
As for wrongful trading, if Bryan jackson had given certain advice, and that advice was not followed resulting in further losses to creditors, then all of the directors who received that advice (the old board) but did not act on it may be as well to move their assets to BVI and join Wee Craigie. I wonder what that advice was”
Confidence Trick 5 246 22654 46 6/11/2011 0:12:0 OnandOnandOnand 12 8 “tomtom
I think it might have seemed like it suited his purpose but I doubt that it did while he didn’t have control. The independant board thwarted him in that, they stalled his takeover until after the tribunal in which he played no part. I suspect AJ knew his plan all along.
Lord Wobbly, exposing the charlatan who has taken my club will be a lifelong work, knowing no bounds until freedom….. oh wait, might be watching V for Vendetta that is getting to me”
Confidence Trick 6 251 22659 1 6/11/2011 1:8:0 OnandOnandOnand 12 9 “John
It’s a broad church, all are welcome.
And for the record, if you tried to fix a leak in a Mouldmaster….
a) don’t use your Mum’s best cutlery to get the knife you heat to a red hot poker to melt the plastic, my ears are still ringing and
b) if you leave raggedy bits on the ball, they are sharp as glass and even worse than laces on a leather ball”
Confidence Trick 6 255 22663 5 6/11/2011 1:37:0 OnandOnandOnand 12 10 “Stunney
We have a law on heresay for a reason.”
Confidence Trick 6 258 22666 8 6/11/2011 1:54:0 OnandOnandOnand 12 11 “Tim (nicebutdim)
Can’t see HMRC giving time to pay while their £2.3m arrestment hasn’t been paid over.
The infamous VB interview makes it clear he has already factored in the ‘it wiznae me, we are persecuted’ angle, he can dump Rangers at any time and walk away with the’ new improved’ Rangers”
Confidence Trick 6 259 22667 9 6/11/2011 1:57:0 OnandOnandOnand 12 12 “Stunney
I’m from Edinburgh so Steamie, didn’t twig”
Confidence Trick 6 262 22670 12 6/11/2011 2:8:0 OnandOnandOnand 12 13 “If Stunney is one of the KDS posters, then I will acknowledge a huge indebtedness to him and his cohorts.
When I heard that some unknown CW was proposing to buy Rangers, I spent a good 3 hours on google and other websites then I stumbled on KDS and got loads of information. gave me the links to the bits and pieces which leads me to my views, with a bit of inside knowledge”
Confidence Trick 6 263 22671 13 6/11/2011 2:17:0 OnandOnandOnand 12 14 “StevieBC
read your comments with RTC’s postings that the directors had advice From Bryan jackson, you are spot on”
Confidence Trick 12 584 23007 34 7/11/2011 12:56:0 OnandOnandOnand 12 15 “Paul Mac
Better go to Specsavers, 18th November is a Friday.
To the poster who suggested Wee Craigie/Rangers had paid out £50k to Unicef, would that such generosity were true but it was actually paid from the funds of Rangers Charity Foundation, wee Craigie had nothing to do with it, other than to hand over the cheque and get the publicity for being such a swell guy.
Confidence Trick 14 700 23128 50 7/11/2011 22:51:0 OnandOnandOnand 12 16 “My Lord, be fair, he did send the message out twice, ‘Good for CW, not good for Rangers’, I think light may be dawning, now will he publish what he surely knows?
STV in for a banning, anyone? a bit of Carter Rucking should do it”
Confidence Trick 15 712 23140 12 7/11/2011 23:5:0 OnandOnandOnand 12 17 “RTC, don’t know what’s in the figures but as they’re to 30th June, might not be too many surprises. Would love to see the audit comments and going concern statement though”
Confidence Trick 15 718 23146 18 7/11/2011 23:14:0 OnandOnandOnand 12 18 “RTC
I have endless patience”
Confidence Trick 15 736 23164 36 7/11/2011 23:37:0 OnandOnandOnand 12 19 “RTC @ 11.31pm
Adam, your comments on that post would be appreciated”
Confidence Trick 15 748 23176 48 7/11/2011 23:57:0 OnandOnandOnand 12 20 “BRTH
Thanks for the offer of a G & T but I’m off the booze, it’s a school night.
RTC/Adam the discussion on the cash flow between you both and others was fascinating. Given a broad brush, should the opening balance be about £2m? If so, subsequent arrestments, which have the effect of lifting those sums out of cash, would decimate this and, in effect, reduce this to a negative opening balance. If so, Rangers have no cash as of now unless CW puts more in, is this correct?”
Confidence Trick 15 750 23178 50 8/11/2011 0:2:0 OnandOnandOnand 12 21 “Adam @ 11.53pm
The CW monies are post 30th June, I think, so can’t be that and assumes CW put in a net £5m”
Confidence Trick 16 756 23184 6 8/11/2011 0:11:0 OnandOnandOnand 12 22 “Adam @ 12.04am
Agreed on that point, although I don’t think that someone who pennypinches and stalls the way he has done would freely invest £5m. On the other hand, he needs to increase his debt so maybe you are correct.
BTW, not sure I like the OOO monicur, I see where it comes from but makes me sound like a ghost, Onandx3 is good. I would change my name if it were allowed, was thought of when the takeover/fakeover went on and on and on and………”
Confidence Trick 16 761 23189 11 8/11/2011 0:20:0 OnandOnandOnand 12 23 “paulmac @12.16am
In my experience, any ‘increase’ in the Wavetower/CW debt will be paper or notional, not hard cash. Any cash he has will be held back to fund the phoenix, to give cash incentives to retain players and key suppliers, to pay football debts if he can’t novate them and suchlike.”
Confidence Trick 16 771 23199 21 8/11/2011 0:39:0 OnandOnandOnand 12 24 “Easyjambo
According to the circular, he would pay the small tax debt”
Confidence Trick 16 774 23202 24 8/11/2011 0:46:0 OnandOnandOnand 12 25 “Easyjambo
Actually, I heard that he was on his way to the tax office to pay the next instalment but he had a hole in his pocket and, oops, must be lying in a brown envelope somewhere between Edmiston Drive and Cotton Street Tax Office, honest”
Taking One For The Team 15 717 24414 17 11/11/2011 15:6:0 OnandOnandOnand 140 1 “Sorry, I have been away ‘up country’ for a few days, out of reach of mobiles and laptops. Looking at the number of posts since I left, it will take me a few days to catch up.
Given that I have only had a cursory glance at some postings, I won’t seek to comment on what has gone before, at least for the present.
It’s amazing the thoughts you have as you cast into a pool in expectation. Perhaps the tax experts could consider this. Wee Craigie goes to Monaco to live in 1999/2000 as the UK tax authorities close in. He stays away there under the radar with occasional forrays back to trouser £200k which was meant to be paid to the taxman (allegedly). He buys Castle Grant in 2006/07 but as it’s a bit of a ruin, let’s assume he doesn’t move in right away and keeps his Monaco tax status. (i. e., doesn’t pay UK tax or at least, not more than £30k from the 2008 Finance Act). How long can he live here and still retain his non-taxpaying status?
It may well be possible that MBB Wee Craigie doesn’t even pay any income tax himself and I’m sure the irony of that will not be lost on some here. If that’s true, tax experts, when does he have to flee back to Monaco to preserve his tax free status? Is it 5 years?”
Taking One For The Team 15 727 24424 27 11/11/2011 15:24:0 OnandOnandOnand 140 2 “TBK
I doubt any of his fabulous wealth will be visible”
The Case: Q & A 17 819 25407 19 15/11/2011 10:28:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 1 “Hugh @10.14
Once the Summary Warrant has been issued re the small tax bill, interest runs at the statutory rate of 8% from date of issue until payment, so £500 a day is not too far off the mark.
It should have been paid, it hasn’t and it’s costing £15,000 a month. It makes no sense not to pay unless you know the arrestment will be defeated by insolvency and the £15k a month just goes into the pot as an ordinary creditor.
Any hold that SDM had over CW goes when the big tax case hearing finishes. Expect an insolvency event soon thereafter.
On the subject of Insolvency Events, the annual Insolvency Conference is being held at Gleneagles tomorrow and Thursday. This is attended by the great, good and not so good of the Scottish insolvency profession, accountants, lawyers, some bankers etc. Given the number of people who will be plying Bryan Jackson with drink to get the story out of him, I suspect the hotel should invest in a stomach pump. It will be interesting to see how many practitioners have been approached to act for creditors trying to get their money”
The Case: Q & A 23 1121 25723 21 15/11/2011 21:56:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 2 “William1968
I have been reading your posts, they start out disjointed and difficult to read but get easier to understand the more you post.
One thing puzzles me. You refer to 5000 companies, is that the total number of companies who used EBTs?”
The Case: Q & A 23 1137 25739 37 15/11/2011 22:14:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 3 “5000 is indeed an interesting figure.
In (I think) 2010, HMRC and the EBT industry got together to reach an agreement that, rather than have HMRC examine every EBT, an agreed number would be examined. HMRC undertook to stick to this number as long as the cases were randomly selected. It suited them to agree this approach as HMRC has finite resources and an office was established in Liverpool to select these random cases. The EBT industry agreed to this as it meant that if a client EBT was not part of the random sample, it would not be looked at. HMRC’s own figures suggested there were 50,000 such schemes.
And the number of EBTs in the random sample………… yep, 5000. William 1968, you know far more about EBTs than you are letting on, my old Sam
Here’s a good link to a firm of advisers (I have no connection to them, I just picked the page randomly after a google search) who set out EBTs n simple terms. Read to the end, see how many EBTs they have recommended
The Case: Q & A 24 1165 25767 15 15/11/2011 22:55:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 4 “William 1968 @ 10.43pm
No, the mention of 5000 companies was first made in your posting of 9.12pm.
I’m sure it’s just a coincidence, eh!”
The Case: Q & A 24 1170 25772 20 15/11/2011 22:58:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 5 “BRTH,
That joke was awful, leave them to Lord Wobbly and TBK
The Case: Q & A 24 1180 25782 30 15/11/2011 23:20:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 6 “k3lly
I can’t see how anyone but SDM benefits from a continuation, should there be one. HMRC want the evidence and submissions concluded, even if there is an insolvency event after conclusion, they will still get a ruling. CW wants it concluded so that he can pull the plug and blame everyone but himself.
A continuation to January with an insolvency event in December may mean the result of the FTT(T) as it relates to MIH may get buried if adverse in the stramash that will be Rangers’ insolvency”
The Case: Q & A 24 1189 25791 39 15/11/2011 23:37:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 7 “Hugh/longtimelurker
No real objection to your analyses, certainly agree re the small tax case, the arrestment was a very astute move, with all its attendant publicity (how did that happen?)
Hugh, I agree no precedent will be set, but a message will be sent. That message will be lost if the tribunal’s decision is weakened by Rangers not being represented should there be an insolvency event before the conclusion”
The Case: Q & A 25 1248 25854 48 16/11/2011 9:55:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 8 “Adam/Badday
Adam is correct, the MG05s confirms the security is a fixed security over the future catering revenue and only that revenue. It doesn’t attach to any other assets.”
The Case: Q & A 26 1253 25859 3 16/11/2011 10:0:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 9 “Adam
The first MG05s was confusing because it was a dog’s breakfast drawn up by an idiot, which was why they had to have it removed from the record”
The Case: Q & A 26 1255 25861 5 16/11/2011 10:2:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 10 “Busted,
Sorry, I know a lot of people speculated as to the meaning of the Close MG05s but its clear in its intention, I think it was just a slow day. By all means ask why CW had to borrow from Close, that is the more interesting question.”
The Case: Q & A 26 1261 25867 11 16/11/2011 10:13:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 11 “EJ
Thanks for that. Clearly gives a security over the catering revenue, what else? It is a fixed security so it only covers the asset pledged, in this case, catering revenue. It has nothing to do with any other assets like Ibrox, Murray Park etc, these are all still within the floating charge”
The Case: Q & A 28 1365 25982 15 16/11/2011 16:53:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 12 “Duggie73
Fanny and fud in the one posting (and both remarkable accurate)”
The Case: Q & A 28 1367 25984 17 16/11/2011 16:53:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 13 “remarkably”
The Case: Q & A 31 1501 26120 1 16/11/2011 21:46:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 14 “As to the mysterious names…….
Given that Wee Craigie may well only have one wheel on his wagon, it would be foolish of him not to look for alternative exit strategies. It may well be that this/these names were not there at the start but have come on the scene lately.
RTC’s last post contained an extract from a document which looks like an internal Rangers memo and confirms that LTSB had been paid and had no indebtedness. If memory serves me correctly, their indebtedness was a term loan of £18m and an overdaft of between £3-4m. If you assume he hasn’t put any more of his own money in, and LTSB were paid in full, he is in the hole for £22m with whatever cash he could raise by mortgaging tickets and catering rapidly dwindling. He may well have been knocked so far off course by arrestments and suchlike that he needs another backer to come in and cut his losses, hence the emergence of new players.
I revise my views posted in May/June, he’s not a smart operator seizing a chance, he’s an out of his depth fud (thanks to duggie73 for the completely accurate description of him)”
The Case: Q & A 31 1514 26133 14 16/11/2011 22:3:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 15 “Hugh/Campsiejoe
Was the raid on Rangers not part of the investigation into transfer irregularities involving Harry Redknapp and others? Stems from an investigation from 2006, the Rangers angle was the transfer of Boumsong for £8m and alleged irregularities as to payments.”
The Case: Q & A 31 1518 26137 18 16/11/2011 22:13:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 16 “Hugh
I can’t remember how that all ended but this link shows some of the names involved
Geeze, there are some ominous names in there”
The Case: Q & A 31 1520 26139 20 16/11/2011 22:17:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 17 “Longtimelurker
I remember mentioning James Mortimer as a possible director of a new board when Wee Craigie took over but it never entered my head that he would make a bid. he’s Rangers through and through but not daft, that’s why he owns most of Royal Exchange Square and the Rogano, as well as 30 or so pubs, numerous nightclubs in Glasgow, London, Manchester etc. He would be unlikely to join the fud club”
The Case: Q & A 31 1541 26161 41 16/11/2011 23:12:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 18 “Hugh,
Possibly a better article to read, was written around the time of the raid on Rangers, gives a bit more detail
The Case: Q & A 31 1546 26166 46 16/11/2011 23:26:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 19 “Paulie Walnuts
How do these rumours square with CW having to raise money from Close and treat every penny as a hostage? If he has backers, why are they not stepping up to the plate behind the scenes?
Your last paragraph would suggest he is in this himself.
Go on, tell us a bit more about the rumours you’ve heard”
The Case: Q & A 32 1553 26173 3 16/11/2011 23:41:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 20 “Hugh/Mark
If I could PM, I would honest. I heard this rumour from a guy……
I find facts best, informed speculation next, rumour is way down the list”
The Case: Q & A 32 1576 26200 26 17/11/2011 8:23:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 21 “Motical @ 2.34
Re item 1, I don’t think there’s any evidence of ‘successfull’ business dealings, just a string of company liquidations with failure to pay HMRC a prominent feature. It may well be that he kept the money he should have paid to Hector and used that to fund his lifestyle.
Re item 3, agreed, the assumption is that he lived in Monaco all of that time but is there any evidence of that? No doubt Monaco was good, with all the ex-pats like Willie McKay living there at the time and the BBC documentary confirms he had Kevin Sykes coming out to Monaco to get paid for his services. What services? Pity the BBC didn’t ask that question. If Sykes was involved, seems clear to me that our Craigie must still have been bursting businesses while disqualified”
The Case: Q & A 32 1578 26202 28 17/11/2011 8:38:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 22 “Jimbo
It only makes sense if CW has run out of money and has now had to seek backers, makes no sense, I agree, if the backers were there all along”
The Case: Q & A 32 1583 26207 33 17/11/2011 9:12:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 23 “RTC @9.06
Agreed re business relationship, someone or some company had to bankroll him, but they can’t be too impressed with the way things have gone. Do you think personal guarantees may be involved or are they, the backers, just taking a punt as they themselves are using ‘other peoples’ money’?”
The Case: Q & A 37 1803 26439 3 18/11/2011 13:7:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 24 “Re the D2, this is the London Gazette code that the Annual Return has been made, nothing more. If you want to see all of the codes, see this example (hope the link works)
The Case: Q & A 42 2089 26766 39 20/11/2011 22:56:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 25 “Hugh @ 10.26pm
As you know, the deposit power only extends to VAT just now. Current practice when taking a deposit from a phoenix newco is to review oldco records, take the last year’s VAT as a yardstick, divide by 12 and ask for 4 months VAT as a minimum deposit. Someone care to work that out?”
The Case: Q & A 42 2096 26773 46 20/11/2011 23:10:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 26 “Hugh, your last sentence is correct. In fact, 4 months is the minimum, 5 is often the case.”
The Case: Q & A 42 2100 26777 50 20/11/2011 23:28:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 27 “Hugh,
Sorry, I’m talking mince, it’s only 4 months minimum if monthly VAT returns, otherwise it’s 6 months
I can’t confirm that they are having current issues with VAT and PAYE/NIC but, looking at Wee Craigie’s past record and they way his is paying everything else at the last minute, wouldn’t surprise me.”
The Case: Q & A 43 2104 26781 4 20/11/2011 23:48:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 28 “Hugh
I’m sure Wee Craigie has factored all of this into his careful calculations.
Anyone out there want to take a stab at the actual figure? I’m sure someone at HMRC has already done it, just in case.”
The Case: Q & A 43 2106 26783 6 21/11/2011 0:18:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 29 “Hugh,
To be honest, I just want it all to come to a head. I have no idea where this will all end but I’m with the posters who hope that the Walls of Jericho will tumble. The administration of the game has failed us, it has strayed so far from the roots and spirit that it is seen as biased by fans of all teams and has become a self serving oligarchy of its own. The clubs are tied in to an unworkable business model, Auldheid and others make perfect sense to me, as do the Mouldmaster Brigade, they would instil passion back into the game. If the whole edifice falls, I for one will not cry. If Darwinism teaches us anything, it is that the slow evolution is matched by the cataclysmic change that steers evolution into something different. It is up to us to make sure that the end result is a fairer place.
Private Land isn’t the only socialist on here, he is in the majority. Football should be by the people, for the people, not for arrogant fuds who think they can make themselves richer at our expense. I hope Rangers survive, division bottom if you may, I don’t know how many divisions there will be. If it’s Division 3, they may well be joined by Hearts, Kilmarnock Hibs and Aberdeen. Where would that leave Celtic and the rest?”
The Case: Q & A 43 2108 26785 8 21/11/2011 0:38:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 30 “Hugh
Chapeau et bon soir”
The Case: Q & A 43 2123 26803 23 21/11/2011 11:23:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 31 “Adam @ earlier
Thanks for that calculation, don’t think I would take issue with any of it. In effect, newco should budget for 6 x £500k, or £3m up front to allow it to trade. Wee Craigie will have to take the cushions off the couches to rustle up that money. (when you have a castle, you have more than one couch)
Or sell the castle, but then what would he be king of ?
He certainly won’t get it from selling Merchant House shares, they’ve taken a nosedive since September so his loan notes are only worth slightly over par, not much profit to be had there.
Where else will he rustle up the money? Ex Monaco friends?”
The Case: Q & A 46 2278 26964 28 21/11/2011 22:44:0 OnandOnandOnand 138 32 “Paul McConville @ 9.54pm
Paul, Fyfe Ireland made it clear that they were the lead Scottish solicitors reporting to Collyer Bristow in the diligence phase. The FI fees would have been well in excess of £50k and so this trivial amount of £1000 plus VAT and some outlays sought to be recovered is just astonishing. Pay £50k+ and quibble about a grand? The man’s a numpty.”
Making a bad situation worse 5 209 28209 9 26/11/2011 21:44:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 1 “In normal circumstances, I would not have been surprised to see a company associated with Wee Craigie to be defaulting on its tax obligations. His modus operandi seems to be to serve as a director for a period, then resign some time before the company goes down and get a patsy to run it into insolvency, paying little, if any, tax before it goes down.
This time, it’s different. Although the Big tax case and the Small tax cases are nothing directly to do with him (ignore the fact that he didn’t pay the small case money for now), he is a director of Rangers and will remain so until he pulls the plug. In every insolvency, the IP must submit a report on the conduct of all those who were the directors within the 2 years prior to the insolvency. The report must comment on all Crown debt outstanding as at the insolvency as well as other matters. To have a significant amount of tax outstanding would usually lead to the Insolvency Service seeking a disqualification. A defence that is was only a couple of months tax won’t run far, it will still be millions. Given that this will be Craigie’s second time before the beak, I would suggest 9 – 12 years disqualification would be the norm. Given that Wee Craigie is well ‘over the radar’ with the Insolvency Service, they may want to expidite matters.
I’m sure he knows this, only a fool or a desperate man would take that risk.”
Making a bad situation worse 5 212 28212 12 26/11/2011 21:52:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 2 “TBK
would I lie to you?”
Making a bad situation worse 5 217 28217 17 26/11/2011 22:3:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 3 “TBK
Well we know he had one run in with the IS which wasn’t a misunderstanding as he was given or took a 7 year ban. I haven’t been able to find out any information about that, maybe some journalist has dug it up under FOI. There is no public record that I know of which gives details of bans in 2000. The IS used to run a database giving detailed information on recent cases but this now seems to havebeen archived and not accessible. Companies House only gives brief information for cases where the disqualification is current, no record once the disqualification ends”
Making a bad situation worse 5 219 28219 19 26/11/2011 22:9:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 4 “TBK
You must be a lawyer, yoos and yer allegedly……. :0”
Making a bad situation worse 5 221 28221 21 26/11/2011 22:11:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 5 “The Don and I share the same social affliction of being smiley inept”
Making a bad situation worse 5 232 28232 32 26/11/2011 22:45:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 6 “Hugh
He won’t be able to avoid being involved in Newco, who would he trust to be a director in his place? Besides, I think Newco will be Wavetower/Group, at least in the first instance and he is already a director of that company. It’s a clean company, apart from the odd mislaid lawyers’ bill, and I suspect that any attempt by HMRC to require deposits of that company will be appealed to FTT(T). Deja vu.
I can’t fault your scenario that there is someone behind this, or rather your hypothesis. Corsica posted earlier about information to the contrary, that this is Whyte by himself. I tend to think that is correct, except that Whyte is using borrowed money rather than his own. His behaviour is of the lone wolf type, not a front man”
Making a bad situation worse 5 235 28235 35 26/11/2011 23:10:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 7 “Hugh
He cares because Wavetower gets the assets, he is Wavetower
It’s not just Close, remember the first MGO5s, the one that now never was. The only place it exists is on this blog. We spent hours agreeing it was mince as a document but the import of what it was trying to do was clear, it took a certain amount of season ticket money for 5 years out of the floating charge security. You would only do that if you had borrowed against it, standard Ticketus practice. This whole venture was funded by Ticketus money and CL participation, when Rangers were put out of Europe, he had to adapt by raising money elsewhere, step forward Mr Betts and Close. As was said earlier today, this Emperor has no clothes.”
Making a bad situation worse 5 243 28243 43 26/11/2011 23:42:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 8 “Hugh @ 11.21
But if the assets are not sold off but transferred to Wavetower to satisfy their debt, he gets the lot.
Geeze, would be great if we had some way of indexing posts and could go back 5 or 6 months to review what was said then. Where is The Don’s eidetic memory when you need it? The ‘Data’ of RTC. I was impressed by Easyjambo’s recall of the £150k earlier. Chapeau”
Making a bad situation worse 5 249 28249 49 27/11/2011 0:0:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 9 “Corsica
Was he in Monaco all of that time? When I started taking all of this seriously in March, I assumed that all the evidence pointed to that. Willie McKay was there too. I happen to know that they both lived there at the time but hadn’t connected them until then. Loads of links to Monaco for both of them. Then I found on google to a FF posting
Costa Rica isn’t whereyou would expect to find MBBs. This guy seems to have some information we don’t know and as it was disclosed in February 2011, before the takeover, is this planted information?”
Making a bad situation worse 5 250 28250 50 27/11/2011 0:2:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 10 “Shug
Stop calling me Shirley 🙂 ”
Making a bad situation worse 6 251 28251 1 27/11/2011 0:8:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 11 “Goosy @11.54
I think there is a 3 month window, December liabilities have to be cleared by March, if CW kept it at 2 months behind, then he would have paid the December payment by March”
Making a bad situation worse 6 255 28255 5 27/11/2011 0:25:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 12 “TBK
I doubt Rangers as we know it will be around by then.
I can’t see the funding Wee Craigie has been able to get lasting until then and as i’ve said before, he will have had to give personal guarantees if he is doing this by himself and so he might end up bankrupt. It will be a complete mess, Rangers will implode and possibly other clubs too, Hearts, Hibs, Kilmarnock, but if it brings down the current league management, and results in something better, as a football fan first and a Rangers fan second, i could live with that”
Making a bad situation worse 6 260 28261 10 27/11/2011 0:42:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 13 “TBK
The house of cards scenario is the best for Scottish football, in the long run, and for your team too, Celtic need to cut costs. I hope in x years time, football clubs will be not for profit clubs who distribute surplus funds to promote the game and are owned by their fans. Who would have thought that 26,000 shareholders/fans (of whom I am one) would have seen their shares in their club become worthless and are powerless to do anything about it? Whyte is the worst option for my club and SDM should be ashamed of passing the management to him, but I’m sure SDM is just glad to be out of it”
Making a bad situation worse 6 264 28265 14 27/11/2011 1:2:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 14 “I doubt this blog will get many comments, boils down to rangers are 1+? months late with their tax payments. I suspect RTC may have more, would be good to hear what that is.
Anyway, night all”
Making a bad situation worse 6 266 28267 16 27/11/2011 1:8:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 15 “Rab @ 12.57
I read your comment with interest but gave up at the ‘leyton orient’ comment.
Troll somewhere else”
Making a bad situation worse 6 268 28269 18 27/11/2011 1:15:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 16 “Adam
chapeau (I think)”
Making a bad situation worse 6 284 28286 34 27/11/2011 8:57:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 17 “Rab @1.19am
Have reviewed the posts of last night and owe you an apology. I misscast you as trolling on the Leyton Orient issue and apologise unreservedly.
A common tactic of trolls is to bring up something that has already been discounted. I appreciate that it was a big brain who raised the issue, Paulie Walnuts, and so the speculation would have gravitas, but that speculation was immediately shot down by others. That’s not to say it’s not true, just seems unlikely. Doncaster would be much more likely if Wee Craigie was going to buy an English team.
Billybhouy68……….. excellent catch. Am positive you are onto something there. Team Discount, just sounds like something they would do, set up a fund to cash in on distressed sports.
Ray Charles, James Holmes is the Chairman of Merchant House Group plc, the holding company in which Craig Whyte has or had a substantial holding until he started selling this off to raise cash and repay his own debt.
The expression thick as theives comes to mind, but perhaps this time the ‘thick’ refers to their intellectual capacities.”
Making a bad situation worse 6 285 28287 35 27/11/2011 9:0:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 18 “thieves…… need my second cup of coffee”
Making a bad situation worse 6 289 28291 39 27/11/2011 9:52:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 19 “Salah/TJ
So that will be another £100k added to the ordinary creditors’ pot. Can’t see Wee Craigie losing any sleep over that (assuming he sleeps), given that Rangers will be suspended from PLUS -SX on Thursday unless they publish their accounts by then.”
Making a bad situation worse 6 293 28295 43 27/11/2011 10:7:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 20 “weeminger
I too keep an eye on MHG. What did you make of the trade and transfer to Willow International? Only made sense to me as repayment of a debt unless Wee Craigie is also Willow.”
Making a bad situation worse 6 300 28302 50 27/11/2011 10:25:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 21 “weeminger
is this a ‘sell’?
Why would Liberty transfer £104k of loan capital to Willow, enabling Willow to get 208m shares and a 6%+ share of MHG? Looks more like Liberty owed Willow money and transferred the loan in satisfaction”
Making a bad situation worse 7 304 28306 4 27/11/2011 10:42:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 22 “Brian_Damage
The £21m to pay off Lloyds (£18m loan and £3m overdraft) came from mortgaging part of the season ticket money for 5 years. Why else seek to exclude that money from the floating charge”
Making a bad situation worse 7 306 28308 6 27/11/2011 10:48:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 23 “Brian
Yes, they cocked it up big time, was a dog’s breakfast. Doesn’t change what happened though, just that their notification to Companies house was a daud of Craig Whyte.”
Making a bad situation worse 7 309 28311 9 27/11/2011 10:59:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 24 “TBK
Thanks for that link, I wondered where the I.S. website had gone.
As to my point about disqualification for not paying Crown debt, look at just how many disqualifications are on that basis
Making a bad situation worse 7 316 28318 16 27/11/2011 11:26:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 25 “TBK
Just look at the number of cases where the reason for disqualification is not paying the Crown. The Companies House website just gives very basic details and once your disqualification is over, it is removed from the record. I’m sure there’s some human rights argument for that but makes it difficult to tell if you’re dealing with a wrong ‘un who might have been banned for 7 years, for example”
Making a bad situation worse 7 317 28319 17 27/11/2011 11:28:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 26 “Adam
It’s like mortgaging future catering revenues.
You may well be right and I may well be wrong but what was the point of registering the first MG05s? There must have been something behind it”
Making a bad situation worse 7 323 28325 23 27/11/2011 11:49:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 27 “Hugh @11.40
They still have to hold an AGM (Companies Act 2006, section 336(1)) as they are a plc. Must be held within 6 months of the accounting reference date, 30th June”
Making a bad situation worse 7 327 28329 27 27/11/2011 11:57:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 28 “3 weeks notice for an AGM (CA, section 307 (2)) and so notice must be given by 9th December at latest. That’s notice to 26,000 shareholders at some considerable cost. Wee Craigie won’t like paying the postage on that.
Good to speak to you all, I must now absent myself for a prior luncheon engagement”
Making a bad situation worse 7 328 28330 28 27/11/2011 12:0:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 29 “sorry, just to clarify, it’s the 8th of December as last day for notice. You don’t count the day of posting and the day of the meeting. Hugh, yes, common practice is for accounts to be sent with notice.”
Making a bad situation worse 9 421 28423 21 27/11/2011 20:9:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 30 “Brian/Campsiejo/timtim/Hugh and others
Maybe there’s a piece of the puzzle missing. SDM has made it a condition of the sale that SDM/MIH control the FTT(T) process, that much we know from previous postings. Could there be a penalty clause that say something along the lines of ‘If you cause an insolvency event before the end of the tribunal, you, Wee Craigie, will be personally liable for, say £10m damages to MIH’, something along those lines, just to tie him into the proceedings. Has anyone seen the full text of the agreement?
PS Hugh, no Killie Pies for me, humble pie, maybe”
Making a bad situation worse 9 425 28427 25 27/11/2011 20:20:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 31 “Campsiejo
SDM has already distanced himself but as the FTT involves MIH as well as Rangers, he wouldn’t want the defence to fall apart as it could do if Rangers suffer an insolvency event”
Making a bad situation worse 9 429 28431 29 27/11/2011 20:45:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 32 “Hugh,
I have nothing to back this up by way of fact but I just don’t understand why he hasn’t triggered an insolvency, he has more than prepared the ground for it. It may be something as simple as he doesn’t believe he will convince the supporters that he was acting in the best interests of the club while there was any hope that they could win the tax case but his bloody minded actings as pointed out above by Brian would suggesthe really doesn’t give a stuff. So, to my mind, there would have to be some other reason, legally enforeceable. Penalty clauses are often used in commercial contracts but maybe Paul or Paulie or others suitably qualified could comment”
Making a bad situation worse 9 434 28436 34 27/11/2011 20:59:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 33 “Hugh
I can’t argue against that, it’s just as plausible as any other theory. Time will tell, I suppose. There will be an irony if he pays over the £2.3m or lets it go, will be the first tax he’s paid in years……”
Making a bad situation worse 9 447 28449 47 27/11/2011 21:31:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 34 “gunnerb
Such a clause wouldn’t do that at all. SDM would have no contact with Rangers, the stick is to beat CW with. I make the point again, MIH are involved in the tax case, they may well have a reasonable defence and don’t want it messed up by Rangers going bust.”
Making a bad situation worse 17 810 28819 10 29/11/2011 14:30:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 35 “Just as an aside, on checking the Plus SX listing for Rangers today to see if anything has been notified (who bought 250 shares today at 14.50p??? do they not read this blog?), I notice the contacts they’ve listed as Company Contacts are David King, Mike McGill and Donald Muir, obviously people well in the loop.
Do I scent a de-listing? Muppet, utter Fudmuppet.”
Making a bad situation worse 17 814 28823 14 29/11/2011 15:0:0 OnandOnandOnand 89 36 “Andy
Not so much of a bargain, 250 shares @14.5p would cost £36.25 plus dealing costs, the ASda one is only £29.00”
Rangers 2011 Financial Results: What Mr. Whyte has not told you 7 303 29556 3 1/12/2011 21:45:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 1 “barcabhoy @9.25
This is the Takeover Panel’s ruling, been posted a few times
Rangers 2011 Financial Results: What Mr. Whyte has not told you 7 316 29569 16 1/12/2011 22:15:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 2 “Barcabhoy
Sorry, don’t know which company you refer to. Nothing in the Takeover Panel’s website which is where you would expect to see such a story. Have a look and see
Might not have been a UK takeover, I suppose”
Rangers 2011 Financial Results: What Mr. Whyte has not told you 7 342 29595 42 1/12/2011 23:14:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 3 “Mark @ 11.03pm
Wee Craigie’s previous form suggests that if you ask difficult questions, he just stonewalls you (see takeover Panel report page5).
Or employs obfuscation, as in he was banned as a director of………. for 7 years, bollocks, he was banned from being a director of, or in the management of any company trading in the UK for 7 years but even the Herald swallowed that obfuscation this morning (see Paulie Walnuts post last night, I think)”
Rangers 2011 Financial Results: What Mr. Whyte has not told you 8 361 29614 11 1/12/2011 23:59:0 OnandOnandOnand 77 4 “Audited and unaudited accounts
Don’t get too hung up on the Plus SX lodgement being of ‘Draft unaudited accounts’, seems it’s okay to do that. Have a look at the Plus SX websiste and see how many companies have lodged unaudited accounts. Some of them are referred to as ‘preliminary’ rather than draft.
The Companies Acts rules are quite different. A quoted plc must lodge audit statements, see Paul McConville’s helpful quote above, it’s a criminal offence not to lodge these on time. The PF at Edinburgh regularly sends penalty notices which, if not paid, can result in a summons/complaint. I suspect that the real difficulty is getting theseaudit statements signed off by GT. As discussed in an earlier post, if they are sending these out with the AGN Notice, the latest these can go out is 8th December”
UEFA License: Rangers to appeal ‘wee bill’ 1 9 29729 9 2/12/2011 18:5:0 OnandOnandOnand 8 1 “Is this not just an attempt to stop the £2.3m arrested by HMRC from being released?”
UEFA License: Rangers to appeal ‘wee bill’ 1 15 29740 15 2/12/2011 18:12:0 OnandOnandOnand 8 2 “Paul McConville
would it not allow him to make an application to the sheriff court to object to the arrestment being completed? Tax bill being appealed, hold the arrestment kind of thing”
UEFA License: Rangers to appeal ‘wee bill’ 1 22 29749 22 2/12/2011 18:30:0 OnandOnandOnand 8 3 “Barcabhoy
l tend to agree with you, this is a stunt to allow him to stop the£2.3m going to HMRC next week and keeping it available to any Receiver in the future”
UEFA License: Rangers to appeal ‘wee bill’ 1 30 29758 30 2/12/2011 18:47:0 OnandOnandOnand 8 4 “Barcabhoy
All they have to do to stop the automatic transfer is lodge a form at the court. Bankruptcy and Diligence Act. The sheriff clerk then fixes a date for a hearing, about 6 weeks hence. Would get him to the New Year. I’m sure Paul and Paulie will give chapter and verse”
UEFA License: Rangers to appeal ‘wee bill’ 2 59 29795 9 2/12/2011 20:17:0 OnandOnandOnand 8 5 “Starting off an application for leave to appeal to the FTT will be grounds enough to apply to the Sheriff Court. If Wee Craigie is this desperate, who knows what lengths he will go to.”
UEFA License: Rangers to appeal ‘wee bill’ 2 78 29815 28 2/12/2011 20:53:0 OnandOnandOnand 8 6 “Paulie Walnuts @8.32
Sorry, don’t agree with you. The application to delay paying over the arrested funds is a sheriff court application in terms of the BAD Act. You have to apply for leave to appeal the small tax case on which the arrestment depends to the FTT but once you’ve done that, you have grounds for your BAD Act application”
UEFA License: Rangers to appeal ‘wee bill’ 2 81 29819 31 2/12/2011 21:0:0 OnandOnandOnand 8 7 “RTC @ 8.32
If the appeal is UEFA related, is this to ensure that the small tax bill is not an admitted debt to allow Rangers to claim it doesn’t require to be settled before 31st March 2012?”
UEFA License: Rangers to appeal ‘wee bill’ 2 84 29822 34 2/12/2011 21:2:0 OnandOnandOnand 8 8 “Johnny
RTC seems to have an angle he has yet to share”
UEFA License: Rangers to appeal ‘wee bill’ 3 135 29875 35 2/12/2011 22:56:0 OnandOnandOnand 8 9 “RTC
Not even the undoubted delights of the aforementioned Buckfast could stimulate my grey cells to the extent that they could work out why an appeal now would have a beneficial effect on UEFA/SFA decisions, past present or future. The representations made to the SFA about the small tax bill would have been made by Rangers per the old board pre May and by Rangers per Shysters Inc post May. It’s all by Rangers though. Unless there is some startling new evidence that has been uncovered, I don’t see how any of this flies. Where is Brogan Hogan etc. when you need him? I shall bow out of this one and leave it to the big brains”
UEFA License: Rangers to appeal ‘wee bill’ 3 150 29895 50 2/12/2011 23:47:0 OnandOnandOnand 8 10 “Auldheid
I can see where you are coming from with the veneer theory but what earthly use is it to Wee Craigie now? It seeks to back up the old board’s representations and provide proof of what they said. What are the consequences if there is no appeal? From what you say, there must be a conclusion to be drawn that the old board misrepresented the position, hence sanctions will be brought now by SFA and, by extension, UEFA for these breaches which will affect Rangers in the future. Is that the argument?”
UEFA License: Rangers to appeal ‘wee bill’ 4 151 29896 1 2/12/2011 23:58:0 OnandOnandOnand 8 11 “Auldheid
In any event, the prospects of an appeal being allowed to be lodged late, never mind heard, must be pretty remote. Thanks to Paul McConville for quoting a case on point. Unless there is radical new evidence, can’t see this going anywhere. Does anyone have knowledge of any new evidence? Anyone seen the Bain or MacIntyre papers and court pleading, especially any defences lodged by Rangers? That might be a source of some evidence, perhaps.”
UEFA License: Rangers to appeal ‘wee bill’ 4 160 29905 10 3/12/2011 0:27:0 OnandOnandOnand 8 12 “Auldheid,
So if there is some evidence that HMRC had written to Rangers confirming the small tax bill could be paid by, say, 30 April, then Rangers would have complied. I suppose that’s possible in a takeover situation. All boils down to evidence which we don’t have. I’m just not sure where RTC is going with this posting. I seem to remember we did the ‘was payment due’ argument in a mere 1000 or so comments in an earlier posting, not sure if I can go there again.”
UEFA License: Rangers to appeal ‘wee bill’ 4 165 29910 15 3/12/2011 0:54:0 OnandOnandOnand 8 13 “Paul
Where was that published?”
UEFA License: Rangers to appeal ‘wee bill’ 4 168 29913 18 3/12/2011 1:7:0 OnandOnandOnand 8 14 “Thanks Paul
So, the Scotsman shows more gumption than the Herald who have been sitting on stories on CW since November last year. Come on, be journalists, publish and be damned, we know you read this so accept the challenge”
UEFA License: Rangers to appeal ‘wee bill’ 5 204 29956 4 3/12/2011 9:27:0 OnandOnandOnand 8 15 “Hugh
The point is the timeline. The application to halt the transfer of funds has immediate effect once served on the bank and HMRC and can’t be dealt with until the first hearing for that application. It goes something like this. Monday, lodge application for late appeal to FTT. Tuesday, lodge application to Sheriff Court to stop the transfer on basis that FTT application is under way and serve this on Bank and HMRC on Wednesday. Money transfer halted. 6 weeks from now, first hearing on the Sheriff Court action. It really doesn’t matter if the FTT bomb out the request on the Thursday, you’ve bought the six week window. I say six weeks as, with Christmas coming up, court business will be delayed. It may well be late January before the hearing re the Sheriff court matter”
UEFA License: Rangers to appeal ‘wee bill’ 6 262 30014 12 3/12/2011 11:41:0 OnandOnandOnand 8 16 “Adam @ 11.23 and 11.37
Me too. It’s painful watching this Shyster in action”
UEFA License: Rangers to appeal ‘wee bill’ 6 269 30021 19 3/12/2011 11:52:0 OnandOnandOnand 8 17 “Private Land
You may well be correct, HMRC could go to the Court of Session,a higher court than the sheriff court and get an order. Maybe the legal bods could comment.”
UEFA License: Rangers to appeal ‘wee bill’ 6 279 30031 29 3/12/2011 12:8:0 OnandOnandOnand 8 18 “Corsica
Perhaps you cold discuss with your sources the possibility that CW’s motivation is to get the assets at a knock down price, then revalue later to increase his asset base against which he can borrow for other purposes”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 1 37 30076 37 3/12/2011 13:25:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 1 “Re the timing of the small bill, there was a very good summary of the timeline by a poster called something like ‘ilive foraccountancy’. Someone should dig that out and repost it”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 1 46 30088 46 3/12/2011 13:39:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 2 “RTC
any chance you could post the whole of that Memo,anonymised as required?”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 3 120 30165 20 3/12/2011 17:41:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 3 “V
Yes and yes, as long as the accounts are laid before the meeting
and its 21 clear days, so dont count day of the meeting or day of posting”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 10 456 30525 6 4/12/2011 22:29:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 4 “Extending accounting periods………..
Current law is section 392 (3) of the Companies Act 2006. Can’t be done if the accounting period was extended in the previous 5 years.
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 10 459 30528 9 4/12/2011 22:32:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 5 “Oh, and the accounts must be circulated 21 clear days before the AGM Section 424 (2). Thursday is last day for posting for both accounts and notice of AGM”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 10 465 30534 15 4/12/2011 23:14:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 6 “Corsica
You assume that there are board meetings, maybe in the pub as Wee Craigie, Phil and Withers drown their sorrows”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 10 466 30535 16 4/12/2011 23:16:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 7 “Greig and McLelland resigned because there were no board meetings, well, none they were invited to”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 10 470 30540 20 4/12/2011 23:41:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 8 “Slimshady
What percentage of shares has to change hands to constitute a change of ownership?
Lord Wobbly, you can have my shares if you like. I shall be waiting expectantly on my notice of AGM and accounts being delivered on Saturday (no way will Wee Craigie send it first class…..)”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 10 476 30546 26 5/12/2011 0:14:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 9 “Corsica
I make the same offer to you as I made to His Lordship, if you want shares, have mine. They came to me from my sadly missed father who is called ‘Birrlin…(insert name)’ as he is spinning so much in his grave”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 10 480 30551 30 5/12/2011 0:36:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 10 “Corsica
Sorry, I didn’t realise you were being serious. Given my earlier postings about the lack of board meetings as evidenced by Greig and McLelland, I thought you would have realised that the idea of Wee Craigie having board meetings was a non-starter. I have no idea why you would spend a grand buying shares when you can pick them up for buttons but I suppose a fool and his money are soon parted”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 10 483 30554 33 5/12/2011 0:57:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 11 “Jean,
Sorry we have not corresponded apart, possibly, from the Mouldmaster episode when I detected a smacking for me.
Please post. You have the knack of grounding some of the posters on here. You wear your heart on your sleeve and challenge us to explain things that you don’t understand and get us to ‘cut the crap’. Be assured, despite some obvious lustings for you from Wobbly, (and a few others) your ‘non-expert’ views often expose more truths than the Big Brains achieve”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 10 485 30556 35 5/12/2011 1:3:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 12 “Corsica
Which law is CW breaking?”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 10 488 30559 38 5/12/2011 1:14:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 13 “Feck, just read that last post. I sound like Adam….
Much as I like Adam, and admire his indefatigability, I don’t seek to justify this regime in any way.
Corsica, my last comment was made most sincerely x”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 13 631 30724 31 5/12/2011 23:25:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 14 “Hugh @ 11.16
He can only use those assets to fund other projects post insolvency when the assets have been transferred to wavetower in satisfaction of the debt due by Rangers. Wavetower is a private company, he couldn’t do this in a plc structure such as Rangers”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 13 641 30734 41 5/12/2011 23:48:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 15 “Sorry, my Don, that’s not strictly correct. The change can be effected by means of a Special Resolution which requires only 75% of the shareholders, If 5% or more of the shareholders who didn’t vote for the change, or more than 50 members, get together, they can petition the court to set aside the Resolution.. Section 98 of the 2006 Act.
I agree that if you have more than 95% of the shareholding, you can do as you like but 75% is the thresh-hold if you want to take your chances in court”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 14 652 30746 2 6/12/2011 0:18:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 16 “The Don
It’s pretty academic anyway. CW won’t shell out a penny more for shares. No chance of him taking the plc private”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 16 782 30885 32 6/12/2011 16:57:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 17 “RTC
It’s not that original as an idea, though. Willie McKay has been doing something similar at Doncaster
Must be something about people who live in Monaco…..”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 18 895 31002 45 7/12/2011 9:49:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 18 “Hugh @8.45am
Sorry but the Sheriff Court rolls are published for about a week in advance. You won’t get to see a listing of any hearing until, probably, some time in January. Some of the legal folks on here might have a good enough relationship with the clerk’s office to ask if anything has been lodged.
As an example, if you look at the listing for this and next week in Glasgow Sheriff Court, all it shows of interest is the One Stop v Tixway proof starting on Monday next at Glasgow Sheriff Court. Anyone taking bets on it proceeding? Maybe some retired posters could pop along and give us a blog on it”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 19 906 31013 6 7/12/2011 10:51:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 19 “Hugh @10.29
The application could have been lodged on Monday this week but the first you would know about it from the public court records would be the week before it was due to call for a hearing”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 19 918 31025 18 7/12/2011 12:12:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 20 “Hugh @10.58
Yes, once served on the bank and HMRC. Everything would be put on hold until the hearing, whenever that is fixed”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 19 921 31028 21 7/12/2011 12:38:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 21 “Hugh,
No problem. When the application is lodged a date is fixed for the hearing. Service copies of that application are then prepared and seved on the arrestor, HMRC and the Bank. These service copies give a full copy of the original application and the court order fixing a hearing. This is all done administratively at the Court, the Sheriff has no input until the hearing. These service copies are usually served by post or Sheriff Officer, by SO to be sure of quick service.”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 20 966 31074 16 7/12/2011 15:25:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 22 “Adam
As a shareholder, if CW gave you 3 days notice of an AGM, would you agree to such a shortened period? (assuming you could make it to the BVI in time)”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 22 1054 31165 4 7/12/2011 22:11:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 23 “Corsica @4.44pm
I’m confused. Why did you have to buy 10 shares to get a copy of the ‘m & a’? Where did you buy your shares and why not just get a copy of the Memo and Articles from Companies House like everyone else? I didn’t realise that you got a copy of the Memo and Articles with a share purchases.
Last question, how did you come to find out that Ellis lied to you and your partner?”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 22 1066 31177 16 7/12/2011 22:49:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 24 “Corsica
Ah, I see. I suppose you’re correct, Companies House won’t have the M & A as it is such an old company, good thinking, buy some shares and write to Gary Withey to ask for a copy, as well as the board minutes. Good luck with that one.
I suppose the trade in shares won’t show up on the plus market listing as settlement date hasn’t come yet. I always thought that shares showed up sameday but I would be wrong in that.
I’m still not clear on what Ellis actually said but realise you have no obligation to say. Did Ellis say how much Wee Craigie was really worth?”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 22 1073 31185 23 7/12/2011 23:1:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 25 “TBK
Witness for the prosecution or defence……”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 22 1085 31197 35 7/12/2011 23:17:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 26 “TBK
it would seem that the witness is reluctant to answer”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 22 1094 31206 44 7/12/2011 23:41:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 27 “Corsica
If you’ve changed the accounting reference date in the last 5 years, are you free to change it again, as a plc with traded shares?
Still waiting to hear what Ellis actually said”
‘Sources close to Whyte’ in economical with truth shocker! 23 1105 31218 5 8/12/2011 0:1:0 OnandOnandOnand 23 28 “Corsica
Thank you for yout patient posts, I won’t press on the Ellis issue, as you say, to disclose more may reveal your own identity to Ellis, at least, and that may well filter back to the Whyte camp.
When all has come to pass, you could add a footnote on that to RTC’s treatise, Volume III perhaps”
The Sensational Sun 2 53 31304 3 8/12/2011 9:24:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 1 “There was a wee shyte called Craig
On whose promises he did renage
He said ‘Stuff all of youse,
Ah’ll do as a’h dos’
Or something equally vague”
The Sensational Sun 2 74 31327 24 8/12/2011 10:56:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 2 “No announcement to the Plus market that there will be no AGM.
Perhaps he will call the AGM with a resolution to immediately adjourn same, given he has 85% of the votes he will win that and may well point this out in the covering letter to the 26,000 shareholders so that they don’t bother coming along.
Corsica, I hope you had a pleasant flight, what are your thoughts on developments?
As to fines etc, don’t hold your breath. There are 2 types of fines, those imposed by Companies House for failure to lodge accounts and audit statements and fines imposed by a Court for breaches of the Companies Acts that are declared as criminal offences. (failure to hold an AGM for a publicly traded company is one of those). In the first case, it will take a month for CH to start the process of fining and, from memory, it’s £3000 per quarter. In the latter case, the fiscal at Edinburgh would issue a summons for any breach of the Companies Act, take the directors and the company to court and it would be up to a Sheriff to decide guilt and fine level, at least 6 months hence. If they try to expidite the process, they will face claims of prejudice. Rangers and its directors could avoid criminal sanctions by holding the meeting and adjourning same.
Doesn’t excuse the failure to lodge accounts though.”
The Sensational Sun 2 80 31334 30 8/12/2011 11:23:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 3 “From Kerrydale Street
Don’t be too surprised if they get some unexpected unpleasant news before the New year”
The Sensational Sun 2 92 31346 42 8/12/2011 11:55:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 4 “TBK
Sorry, I was following on from Hugh’s FF post and so ‘they’ refers to the FF posters, all members of RNIB (Govan Branch)
Hugh, no idea if it’s true.”
The Sensational Sun 9 408 31686 8 9/12/2011 10:59:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 5 “Bain Martin
He should at least make an effort, given that it is a criminal offence to fail to deliver accounts and reports to Companies House by the due date and, yes it is prosecuted on a regular basis, usually by a small fine, known as a fiscal fine, but that is recorded as a conviction, I think. Calling all legal bods to clarify. Every director and the company is subject to criminal prosecution. It is a defence to say that all reasonable steps were taken to get the accounts delivered on time but to run that defence, he would need Grant Thornton’s evidence. Would that be forthcoming?”
The Sensational Sun 10 451 31730 1 9/12/2011 13:39:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 6 “Easyjambo
Sorry, I must have missed something. I appreciate that McIntyre got permission from the court to arrest up to £300,000 but did he ever find assets to arrest? (apart from medals, hastily given back). I can’t remember any reports of a successful arrestement but perhaps my memory is as bad as Hugh’s.
If nothing was arrested then Rangers will have to find the money to pay McIntyre, however much that was, with hefty expenses. More money out of the coffers.
Maybe Wee Craigie has legal expenses insurance from the AA. (Other insurers are available)”
The Sensational Sun 10 463 31742 13 9/12/2011 14:3:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 7 “TBK,
Lord Hodge said, in effect, ‘ go away and sort it out by next week or earlier’. I can’t think of any circumstances where McIntyre would take any kind of payment other than in full, including expenses. It’s quite common to settle cases that way, along the lines of ‘here’s a (insert number) in full and final settlement’. McIntyres lawyers would tell him how much their bill was and McIntyre then knows how much cash he’s getting. He’ll have the money by next Friday.”
The Sensational Sun 10 488 31767 38 9/12/2011 15:33:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 8 “Corsica
Two points. We were led to believe CW was a resident of Monaco between 2000 and 2007 (although metion has been made of Costa Rica at some point). Have you information that contradicts the 7 years residence in Monaco which coincided with his disqualification period?
Secondly, You do not know Lord (Patrick) Hodge. If he says by next week, he means it.”
The Sensational Sun 11 518 31797 18 9/12/2011 16:35:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 9 “Criminal Offences relating to companies.
Okay, Wee Craigie may have a certain disregard for offences, given that he is never likely to have to apply for an FSA licence but Withers, as Company Secretary, is a practicing solicitor and needs to be careful about these things.
As the nights are fair drawing in, here’s a competition for you, see how many criminal offences have been or about to be committed out of this list
( a clue, I count at least 10, assuming he has not destroyed any documents or bumped the auditors)
A prize for the winner ……”
The Sensational Sun 13 602 31883 2 10/12/2011 0:1:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 10 “Fantastic amount of digging going on here. Well done all. It seems Wee Craigie or a company owned byhim buys the castle, with or without a mortgage and proceeds to spend dosh on doing it up, but not very successfully if his wife’s posting is anything to go by. If the castle is indeed in Tixway UK’s name, it shows us how he operates by using one asset to back another venture.
Tixway buys castle, adds value by whatever means, possible revaluation, then uses asset value of Tixway UK to step in to provide a guarantee for the financial obligations of Merchant House Group plc. No cash changes hands, apart from about £140k he puts in by way of loan notes. He gets significant control over a small merchant bank for £140k which allows him to use the Merchant Capital subsidiary, FSA registered, to raise funds from the public for other ventures, Merchant Corporate Recovery and the rest. And all for £140k which he has had repaid several times over by the loan notes (those of you with longer memories may remember my earlier posting on this).
He can do all that with about £1.8m of assets in Tixway and £140k in cash, think what he would do if he got his hands on all of Rangers. He could leverage the Rangers assets into much bigger projects. I still maintain that is why he wants Rangers, it’s nothing to do with player sales and bailing out, I doubt he would even get his money back.”
The Sensational Sun 13 609 31890 9 10/12/2011 0:16:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 11 “BRTH
So Monday’s hearing will not go ahead. He will settle with One Stop, not to do so would risk a judgement against Tixway UK. How could he risk that? The castle, the merchant bank interest, all gone. That’s why I posted a few days ago that I couldn’t see this hearing going on, not because he wouldn’t give evidence.”
The Sensational Sun 14 655 31938 5 10/12/2011 12:36:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 12 “Another two names to look up, Citypoint Investments plc and MCR Support Services Limited. Citypoint was would up by a creditors liquidation, not sure there’s any link there.
MCR Support Services were wound up by HMRC just over 18 months from incorporation. You have to be going some to get wound up that quickly. Merchant Corporate Recovery plc is at the same address, might just be a coincidence.
These names came up when I searched for Aldermary House, Whyre’s London base, in the London Gazette. See for yourself
This also shows that Merchant House Group plc had 2 winding up petitions against it before the Whyte Knyght stepped in and ‘rescued’ them”
The Sensational Sun 15 711 31997 11 11/12/2011 0:13:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 13 “sorrynocando
I think Hugh was trying to suggest that the company the BBC alleges Wee Craigie was struck off for (excuse the grammar) was Vital Holdings Limited. You insist that it was Vital UK Limited, in line with the Plus SX statement. In your version, you support the Plus Sx statement that said Wee Craigie was banned from being a director of Vital UK Limited for 7 years. The BBC said he was disqualified from being a director.
Of any company.
For 7 years
The company he was a director of when his conduct justified a disqualification of 7 years was Vital Holdings Limited.
Is this correct now?”
The Sensational Sun 16 786 32076 36 11/12/2011 19:29:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 14 “On the question of where he got his money, what was the point of the now hidden MG05s if not to mortgage 5 years’ season ticket money? Use that tp pay off LTSB, a bit of working capital and start paying it back from this seasons ticket money. Went off the rails when we were dumped out of Europe, hence going to Close for another dip. I don’t think it’s a secret at all”
The Sensational Sun 16 800 32092 50 11/12/2011 19:54:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 15 “BTRH,
No ‘bank’ will lend him that money as you well know. There are plenty of funds out there who will, given that they hold other peoples’ money and there are big commissions to be earned on the lending.”
The Sensational Sun 17 802 32094 2 11/12/2011 19:55:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 16 “Andy @ 7.5apm
To my mind, when Wee Craigie says it’s not true, then it must be true”
The Sensational Sun 17 812 32104 12 11/12/2011 20:15:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 17 “BRTH
I don’t think any bank will touch a football club if given the choice. I really don’t think it matters, there is no mystery backer, just a leveraged buy-out. You say you spend time in London, you must know how muchmoney is sloshing about.
My very real fear is that Whyte will be here for a while. I don’t know why he hasn’t pulled the plug, unless he is committed to waiting until the evidence and summation process is over at the FTT(T). Once that happens and he forces Rangers into recivership, he will come out the other end as the sole owner. I only hope he has screwed up enough for the wheels to fall off his wagon before the event and a John Boyle figure steps in to pick up the pieces. The fallout could well mean that Rangers are in the third division, so be it, we will be playing Hearts there on a regular basis”
The Sensational Sun 17 819 32111 19 11/12/2011 20:38:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 18 “BRTH
Remember my post from 2 nights ago, he’s not looking for a buyer if he wants to use the Rangers assets to fund other projects. Worst case, he takes it into receivership, comes out, uses the asset value then fecks off in 2 to 3 years to let Rangers fall into liquidation as he defaults in the debt mountain he has created. Double dip insolvency, that’s what I see when I see Whyte.”
The Sensational Sun 17 821 32113 21 11/12/2011 20:42:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 19 “Oh, and if you think double dip insolvency isn’t likely, have a look at LM Logistics,the one on the BBC programme, that’s the company that put the fear in me when I was looking into his background in April this year, 2 insolvencies in one year. I don’t think he got any money out of that, having read the administrator’s report, he lost about £600k of MCR money in that one but that was other people’s money so why should he worry.”
The Sensational Sun 17 823 32115 23 11/12/2011 20:50:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 20 “Hugh,
Sorry, I didn’t mean he comes out of receivership, that was clumsy of me. He gets the assets from the receiver to satisfy the debt through wavetower, old Rangers dies. It’s Rangers 2012 that goes on until it too gets fecked”
The Sensational Sun 17 828 32120 28 11/12/2011 21:21:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 21 “BRTH
I don’t think he cares or is reckless. Maybe he went into this genuinely thinking he could turn Rangers around like a good turnaround specialist. Okay then, show me one, just one company that he has turned round in the last 10 years. He’s not an asset stripper either, just seems to be a clown with a talent for bursting companies. Yes, he has made a good investment in Merchant House and has got his loan money back but MHG is a bit of a basket case. Can someone, anyone, find me a company he has really turned around? Tixway seems to be his asset base (all £1.5-2m, hardly a billionnaire) but I fully accept he may well have other investments and business activities under the radar. he says he has interests in Holland and France, can our posters from those jurisdictions find out from their equivalent of Companies House what those interests are. Corsica?”
The Sensational Sun 17 829 32121 29 11/12/2011 21:24:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 22 “Hugh @9.19
Wavetower becomes Rangers 2012, it’s a single purpose company, formed to do the deal. he wouldn’t want to transfer the asset again (SDLT , old Stamp duty to pay and we know how he loves paying taxes) and wouldn’t need to”
The Sensational Sun 17 833 32125 33 11/12/2011 21:32:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 23 “Hugh
As you can see from earlier posting, having 85% of a listed plc has its problems…….. for example, have to call pesky AGMs (or not)
Whyte is Rangers’ very own Hurrican Bawbag”
The Sensational Sun 17 834 32126 34 11/12/2011 21:33:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 24 “sorry, my spelling is terrible tonight, I will be getting a rebuke from My Don”
The Sensational Sun 17 840 32132 40 11/12/2011 21:52:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 25 “Gwared
he does all of this for a lease at £1m a year? Possible, if he can still borrow against the asset with a tenant in place, I don’t think that’s out of the question. bear in mind that he might well have had to pay £21m to LBG, loan and overdraft as at May 2011 so that’s about a 5% return before tax….. feck, I said the T word. Not sure 5% would do it for him”
The Sensational Sun 17 842 32134 42 11/12/2011 21:59:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 26 “Gwared,
I don’t think everyone was claiming that. Even if it was at a £5m discount to £16m, it’s still not the kind of return that I would expect him to wet his pants about”
The Sensational Sun 17 846 32138 46 11/12/2011 22:21:0 OnandOnandOnand 30 27 “Johnboy
The said Mr Keatings is also a director of MCR Support Services, the now liquidated by HMRC company I referred to earlier this morning……..
I don’t know what the relationship is between Wee Craigie and this man but it seems tight. I remember cross referencing their directorships a while back and they have a few companies in common, can’t remember which ones but a simple check at Companies House would do it. I have an early flight so have to go now, unlike Corsica, my destinations are not exotic but hey ho, have to earn a crust.”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 2 69 32319 19 12/12/2011 22:19:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 1 “RTC
I seem to remember you saying that £1.7m was lodged with Withers’ firm, not £5m, or have I misremembered?”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 2 77 32327 27 12/12/2011 22:39:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 2 “Eddie rice/easyjambo
Tixway was a UK registered company and so the conduct would take place in the UK, even if signed by a BVI company. Interesting to look at the terms of the Company Directors Disqualification Act, section 1
Disqualification orders: general. .
(1)In the circumstances specified below in this Act a court may, and under section 6 shall, make against a person a disqualification order, that is to say an order that [F1for a period specified in the order’ .
(a)he shall not be a director of a company, act as receiver of a company’s property or in any way, whether directly or indirectly, be concerned or take part in the promotion, formation or management of a company unless (in each case) he has the leave of the court, and…..
Note the ‘directly or indirectly…..take part in…… the management of a company’. It’s far wider than just being banned from being a named director, just being involved in a company’s affairs could be enough”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 2 97 32347 47 12/12/2011 23:41:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 3 “BillyBhoy68
Do you have any accounts for Tixway? I see they lodged a certificate of exemption from lodging accounts (item 16, I think, the one headed DCA) as this was a dormant company. So what happened to the 450,000 euro loan it received from Pelham Holdings in 2002 (item 2)?”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 3 102 32352 2 12/12/2011 23:46:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 4 “Droid asked who had the cleaning contract, the answer came back that it was Elior, formerly Azure. Isn’t Elior catering, not cleaning? I suspect Droid had his reasons for asking, can anyone confirm that Elior does indeed do the cleaning? And Droid, spill!”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 3 107 32357 7 13/12/2011 0:0:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 5 “Thanks Easyjambo, The DCA (item 11, sorry got that wrong before) shows the position for 2006 and 2007 and so the company has been dormant for some time. We would really need to see the accounts between 2002 and 2006 to find out where the 450k euros might have gone.
Incidentally, there is a UK company called Pelham Holdings Limited but I don’t think this has anything to do with the Pelham Holdings based in the Bahamas. Once again, CW takes a company name that is remarkably similar to a well established reputable company (there is a well established UK company named Liberty Capital)”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 3 111 32361 11 13/12/2011 0:11:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 6 “Easyjambo
Thanks for that. So a dormant company grants a debenture for 450,000 euros in March 2002, hmmmm”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 3 113 32363 13 13/12/2011 0:14:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 7 “BRTH
Since when did the papers ever seek to correct anything about Wee Craigie?
Sleep beckons, goodnight fellow sleuths”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 3 118 32368 18 13/12/2011 0:27:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 8 “Barcabhoy
Try searching the Dutch records for directorships held by Craig Whyte, Craig Thomas Whyte, Craig White, Thomas Whyte, James Holmes, Phillip Betts, Peter Hall, Christopher Keatings, have I missed any names of Whyte and associates”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 3 119 32369 19 13/12/2011 0:28:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 9 “Aiden Early (?), Andrew Ellis……..”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 3 122 32372 22 13/12/2011 0:36:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 10 “Insomniac
Thanks for the link, I see the announcement was made in August 2011. I wonder if the previous cleaning company were paid?”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 4 190 32447 40 13/12/2011 12:13:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 11 “Hevghirl
He really is that stupid, spoonfed bufoon, but is not alone in that so unfair to single him out”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 4 192 32450 42 13/12/2011 12:20:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 12 “Hevghirl @11.46
Forgot to say that, once again, mention is made of Costa Rica by an FF poster of all people and in February. I don’t know what this connection is but there seems some kind of connection with Costa Rica during the disqualification period”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 7 313 32580 13 13/12/2011 21:6:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 13 “Paulie Walnuts @ 8.30pm
I haven’t seen the court papers and so don’t know what his defence is, it may be a straight One Stop are lying’ defence but may be more complicated than that. Can you really ask endless questions about his ‘under the radar’ wealth? I assume that his own lawyer will have something to say about that and the Sheriff might want to press on once the point is made. I have no respect or tolerance for the man but the picture you paint seems more akin to Perry Mason than Glasgow Sheriff Court. Let’s not pump this up to be more than it is, surely it’s enough that Wee Craigie (aged, 39, 40 or 42) made an arse of himself when answering the question about his disqualification. Unless someone is there taking notes to report to us later, who knows what he will be asked.
It’s a proof before answer, agents will come back to argue the legal points at a later date and then the judge will take the case away for consideration (I know you know that, Paulie, but others may not). Can’t see a decision on this until Feb/March, do you agree?”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 7 319 32586 19 13/12/2011 21:21:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 14 “TBK
Proof before answer is a hearing on evidence, then the lawyers get the chance to argue the law in light of the evidence led and the pleadings”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 7 338 32605 38 13/12/2011 22:27:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 15 “Goosey
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 8 354 32621 4 13/12/2011 23:7:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 16 “Paulie Walnuts
‘In short vintage Whyte, as anyone who dealt with Vital back in the day will tell you’
Are we to take it that you dealt with cases against Vital Holdings or Vital UK in the past then? When was this? Anything you can tell us about without breaching client confidentiality?”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 8 371 32639 21 13/12/2011 23:30:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 17 “Corsica
Just go to the interactive investor website and search for Merchant House Group, then check the discussion section in November 2011. Someone asked what ramping was all about, look at the postings on there from just before the annual results were announced until about 2 months after and check the share price graph, you’ll see what ramping a share is all about.”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 8 390 32658 40 14/12/2011 0:1:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 18 “Paulie Walnuts @ 11.50pm
This was posted earlier tonight
Colm Buddy Clancy says:
13/12/2011 at 10:05 pm
Lifted from daily record
Rangers billionaire Craig Whyte mobbed by fans after popping in to his local
Nov 22 2010 Charlie Gall
Fans pose with tycoon set to buy club
BILLIONAIRE Craig Whyte was swamped by Rangers fans at his local pub ‘ after punters recognised him as the man bidding to buy their club.
Supporters clamoured to get pictures of the tycoon and his new blonde girlfriend as they popped in for a quiet drink in Grantown-on-Spey, Moray.
Whyte visited the Claymore Bar on Saturday night just hours after Rangers beat Kilmarnock 3-2 in the Scottish Premier League.
The self-made moneyman ‘ who shuns the spotlight ‘ has retreated to his hideaway, Castle Grant on the out skirts of Grantown-on-Spey, as he mulls over a £32 million bid for the Glasgow giants.
Whyte, 39, has split from his wife Kim ‘ who still stays in the Highland village in a mansion bought for her by the wealthy financial investor
If the Record are to be believed, he bought her a mansion, a bit of a come down from a castle but better than a single end, so he can’t be that skint………… or DR prints usual pish.”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 8 392 32660 42 14/12/2011 0:9:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 19 “OnandOnandOnand says:
Your comment is awaiting moderation.
14/12/2011 at 12:01 am
Paulie Walnuts @ 11.50pm
This was posted earlier tonight
Colm Buddy Clancy says:
13/12/2011 at 10:05 pm
Lifted from daily record
Rangers billionaire Craig Whyte mobbed by fans after popping in to his local
Nov 22 2010 Charlie Gall
Fans pose with tycoon set to buy club
BILLIONAIRE Craig Whyte was swamped by Rangers fans at his local pub ‘ after punters recognised him as the man bidding to buy their club.
Supporters clamoured to get pictures of the tycoon and his new blonde girlfriend as they popped in for a quiet drink in Grantown-on-Spey, Moray.
Whyte visited the Claymore Bar on Saturday night just hours after Rangers beat Kilmarnock 3-2 in the Scottish Premier League.
The self-made moneyman ‘ who shvns the spotlight ‘ has retreated to his hideaway, Castle Grant on the out skirts of Grantown-on-Spey, as he mulls over a £32 million bid for the Glasgow giants.
Whyte, 39, has split from his wife Kim ‘ who still stays in the Highland village in a mansion bought for her by the wealthy financial investor
If the Record are to be believed, he bought her a mansion, a bit of a come down from a castle but better than a single end, so he can’t be that skint………… or DR prints usual p*sh
I’ve re-posted this to take out the offending word, being ‘shvns'”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 12 585 32866 35 14/12/2011 23:37:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 20 “Paul McConville
Would the Brendan Earley you refer to be in any way related to Aiden Earley?”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 12 586 32868 36 14/12/2011 23:38:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 21 “TBK,
That will teach me to read before posting….”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 12 591 32873 41 15/12/2011 0:1:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 22 “TBK
I think all the pieces are there to make a pretty picture, they just have to be set out properly
Like you, I’ll look at this afresh tomorrow”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 12 596 32878 46 15/12/2011 0:13:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 23 “Curious Onlooker
It might have been interesting but from the sounds of it, the Pursuers have closed their case and the defenders are now giving evidence. Don’t think MBB would really want to call his Dad to the stand unless necessary but who knows.”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 13 645 32931 45 15/12/2011 14:47:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 24 “BillyBhoy68 says:
15/12/2011 at 1:42 pm
Thanks for posting those documents. The first Administrator’s Report, the one before the one you posted, is more interesting in highlighting the loss to Merchant Corporate Recovery. Now look at the last set of accounts for MCR. I appreciate that the loss happened before the accounts year end but I defy you to find anything that confirms the Administrators comments (made a good 3 months before those accounts were signed off) that the investment is a total loss. On the contrary, the director’s statement and Notes to the account suggest the contrary. If the accounts were prepared on a proper basis, would MCR be solvent? So much for a true and fair view, gives some insight into how Wee Craigie runs his companies.”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 18 869 33182 19 18/12/2011 16:21:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 25 “Die rice
well, one year and one month (smiley face)”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 18 870 33183 20 18/12/2011 16:22:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 26 “Eddie (cold fingers and small keyboard)”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 27 1307 33653 7 20/12/2011 20:57:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 27 “Duggie73
The answer to your question is 9.25%. That’s the interest rate offered to investors (members of the public). Look at how little interest you can get on high street accounts and you will see that the rate offered is attractive. The rate of 9.25% was offered by Merchant Corporate Recovery when raising funds.
BillyBhoy68/eddie rice (and I think insomniac, too many posts to go back and check) provided a really good insight into how the ‘loan’ system works in their analysis of the two Custom companies. Both companies clearly had assets as Palmaris (otherwise known as Pattersons Waste in Scotland, you see their lorries everywhere) would not have paid what they did and the loan, it is argued will have been used in the original ‘purchase’ of these assets, all above board. Unless the assets were transferred in from an earlier company at a very written down value, just before that earlier company goes bust. For example, assets valued at £1m, loan £1m, sold for £1.5m, good business. Assets actually transferred in at written down vale, £100k, loan £1m of which only £100k is actually paid over, the rest is paper, sale at £1.5m, result, quids in by £1.4m. That is a bit of an extreme example but I suspect that the truth isn’t that far away for the Custom companies. If people could post the liquidator’s reports and the receiver’s final report, that might shed more light.
Finally, I notefrom the receiver’s first report that Palmaris ended up putting in a claim for £715,000 against the companies, even they realised they were sold a pup.”
Rangers’ Working Capital Facility Letter Disclosed 27 1319 33665 19 20/12/2011 21:26:0 OnandOnandOnand 42 28 “RTC @ 9.08pm
‘Of course, the last payment from JJB was arrested back some weeks ago. That would not have helped’
Kept that one quiet, eh! Who was it that arrested it?”
Rangers’ Negotiations With HMRC: The Truth Is In There 18 892 34647 42 27/12/2011 0:38:0 OnandOnandOnand 169 1 “Hugh @12.09am
‘Photons have no rest mass but, when moving, have an apparent mass due to their kinetic energy (energy of motion). Using E=mc2, their apparent mass is E/c2′
What makes them move?
I understood the rest, honest.
Off to dream of Mouldmasters. My first chance to catch up for a few days, some interesting stuff, Paul McConville, huge chapeau, I agree with Hugh.
Sorry to disagree with Corsica but the accounts are signed off by the directors, they are the responsible officials and don’t need to be voted on at an AGM to become binding but as Corsica’s PA/legal team will have been enjoying their time off and spending quality time with her/their children, I couldn’t have expected that point to be checked.”
Rangers’ Negotiations With HMRC: The Truth Is In There 18 899 34654 49 27/12/2011 9:43:0 OnandOnandOnand 169 2 “Hugh,
If only you had posted that last night, I might have got some sleep, kept me up all night and now I feel very foolish as I was approaching it from the wrong angle.
The things you learn on this site.”
Rangers’ Negotiations With HMRC: The Truth Is In There 19 906 34661 6 27/12/2011 11:36:0 OnandOnandOnand 169 3 “M’Lud
so what you are saying is that, in effect, I’m whizzing along at about 67,500mph just now.
Feck, there goes some more points on my licence
I think Corsica is just a little off the mark butt, in a way, you are both correct. As I posted earlier today, the directors sign off the accounts and are legally responsible for them. The accounts must also be sent to all shareholders of a trading plc when calling the AGM and are approved by the members at that meeting. I think it is the latter procedure to which Corsica refers but it’s more to give members a chance to question matters in the accounts. It’s still the directors who carry the can if anything is untoward”
Rangers’ Negotiations With HMRC: The Truth Is In There 19 907 34662 7 27/12/2011 11:37:0 OnandOnandOnand 169 4 “but (cold fingers again)”
Rangers’ Negotiations With HMRC: The Truth Is In There 19 915 34670 15 27/12/2011 12:28:0 OnandOnandOnand 169 5 “TBK
The onus on ensuring compliance with the Companies Act rests with the Company Secretary, Withers.”
Rangers’ Negotiations With HMRC: The Truth Is In There 22 1070 34826 20 27/12/2011 21:17:0 OnandOnandOnand 169 6 “Can I try to clear up some confusion here.
The security on favour of Close Leasing was granted on 9th August 2011
as posted by Adam, this is the point at which you would expect the money to be advanced. Note, this is a MG01s, used to notify new securities.
Someone then realises that the floating charge documents don’t reflect this and so on 28th October, an M466 was lodged to confirm that the floating charge was altered to reflect the granting of the fixed security over future catering income to Close
From my experience, the money was lent in August and the October paperwork just tidied this up.”
Rangers’ Negotiations With HMRC: The Truth Is In There 22 1078 34834 28 27/12/2011 21:29:0 OnandOnandOnand 169 7 “Hugh McEwan @9.24pm
Self same lawyers who made such a mess of the May MG05s that they had to go to the Court of Session and have Lord Hodge unravel the mess and order secrecy.
I’m not at all convinced that withers is the sharp lawyer some make him out to be.
As for Close, they have their security, don’t give a toss about the floating charge, I’m sure some at Morton Fraser, acting for Close, might have had a good chuckle at the lack of attention to detail on someone’s part”
Rangers’ Negotiations With HMRC: The Truth Is In There 22 1083 34839 33 27/12/2011 21:41:0 OnandOnandOnand 169 8 “Hugh
And acts for some dodgy clients, Wills & Co Limited, stockbrokers, Clarkson Hill Limited, both censured by the FSA and fined after being represented at the hearings by Withers and his insolvency experience came in handy when they went bust and assets sold or transferred to companies in which Wee Craigie has an interest, Pritchards Stockbrokers and Merchant House Group, respectively
I suppose if I posted my own CV, it would look glowing too.
Finally, with all his experience of AIM and Plus markets, he didn’t think to mention Wee Craigie had been disqualified, as are required by the regs. Maybe Wee Craigie just didn’t tell him.”
Rangers’ Negotiations With HMRC: The Truth Is In There 22 1088 34844 38 27/12/2011 21:55:0 OnandOnandOnand 169 9 “Hugh @9.45pm
I don’t want to get involved in the Phil debate, I don’t know enough about his background to form any view. It may well ne what he was referring to had nothing to do with the Close Leasing security.
The only point I was making was that the Close security was granted on 9th August 2011 and that is when you would expect the money to be paid over. It may not have passed then, Close may have said that they wouldn’t pass over the money until the floating charge was altered and held on to it until 28th October. I just think that is unlikely. For one thing, there is no reason the M466 and MG01s could not have been done at the same time, that’s how it usually works.
Sorry, I know it sounds implausible that lawyers get it so wrong but they do, every day. I’ve had occasion to call a number of firms to account when they get documents wrong and you wouldn’t believe some of the dross that passes over my desk from so called top notch lawyers (who invariably write their own cv!)”
Rangers’ Negotiations With HMRC: The Truth Is In There 22 1098 34854 48 27/12/2011 22:15:0 OnandOnandOnand 169 10 “Hugh @ 10.06pm
Close didn’t miss anything, they got their security and they’re out of the equation at that point. They may have insisted that the floating charge be altered and no-one did anything about it until October. I just don’t see how the alteration is significant and Easyjambo’s summary at 10.03pm above seems pretty well spot on to me as far as it relates to the securities.”
Rangers’ Negotiations With HMRC: The Truth Is In There 23 1114 34870 14 27/12/2011 22:34:0 OnandOnandOnand 169 11 “Hugh McEwan @ 10.24
Floating charges are often over all assets, in so far as not specifically charged (by a fixed security, for example). The paperwork here is entirely normal, save for the fact that the M466 is over 2 months after the MG01s and I suggest that is down to ineptitude. Given that the current board of Wee Craigie and Mr Close aka Phil Betts, ably assisted by Withers as company secretary, seem to lurch from crisis to crisis, nothing surprises me”
Rangers’ Negotiations With HMRC: The Truth Is In There 23 1124 34880 24 27/12/2011 23:1:0 OnandOnandOnand 169 12 “Hugh @10.45pm
Fixed charges usually take priority over floating charges, Close got a good security in August. Sorry, have to go out now, Dad’s taxi”
Rangers’ Negotiations With HMRC: The Truth Is In There 27 1332 35092 32 28/12/2011 19:9:0 OnandOnandOnand 169 13 “Paul McConville
You would expect the Company Secretary to have that comprehensive knowledge”
Rangers’ Negotiations With HMRC: The Truth Is In There 27 1336 35096 36 28/12/2011 19:13:0 OnandOnandOnand 169 14 “Hugh
l have seen no evidence that would make me change my view”
Rangers’ Negotiations With HMRC: The Truth Is In There 27 1339 35099 39 28/12/2011 19:27:0 OnandOnandOnand 169 15 “Hugh
Had l been in his position, l would have resigned. The fact that he hasn’t speaks volumes to me.”
Rangers’ Negotiations With HMRC: The Truth Is In There 30 1496 35266 46 29/12/2011 21:31:0 OnandOnandOnand 169 16 “If the accounts have been signed off, you should see them here tomorrow
assuming they publish them as required to, otherwise it will be next Wednesday/Thursday when they will be available at Companies House (don’t think they are working 31st December)”
Rangers’ Negotiations With HMRC: The Truth Is In There 31 1506 35276 6 29/12/2011 21:56:0 OnandOnandOnand 169 17 “Adam @ 9.34pm
Plus accounts are lodged electronically, the Plus filing deadline was met at 16.31 on 30th November, always cut to the wire. The audited accounts are an event they require to notify to the market and so should, and I stress should, be lodged, probably 16.31 on 30th December but they may do it 31st December.
They will be lodged or not, I for one can wait and see little point in speculating until then. Just to be clear, I don’t expect to see anything new in the numbers, it’s the audit report/ true and fair view/going concern/ treatment of the Close loan that may prove interesting”
Rangers’ Negotiations With HMRC: The Truth Is In There 31 1530 35300 30 29/12/2011 23:10:0 OnandOnandOnand 169 18 “RTC
31 June………. priceless. Maybe they will have corrected that by now
[RTC Edit: very funny smart arse! 🙂 ]”
Rangers’ Negotiations With HMRC: The Truth Is In There 31 1531 35301 31 29/12/2011 23:19:0 OnandOnandOnand 169 19 “RTC
You were right the first time, the draft unaudited accounts are to 31 June 2011, see here
paragraph beginning ‘In May, 5th paragraph”
Rangers’ Negotiations With HMRC: The Truth Is In There 31 1535 35305 35 29/12/2011 23:38:0 OnandOnandOnand 169 20 “Adam @ 11.29pm
No, they’re not approved by Plus, they are just uploaded through a financial newswire system, look at the draft unaudited accounts a few postings ago, Dow Jones Newswire”
Rangers’ Negotiations With HMRC: The Truth Is In There 31 1541 35311 41 29/12/2011 23:58:0 OnandOnandOnand 169 21 “Just to remind you, Wee Craigie is no stranger to qualified accounts in plcs. Merchant Corporate Recovery plc’s one and only set of accounts were qualified by the auditors as they couldn’t agree the basis of valuation of the investments. The next set of those accounts will be interesting but we will have to wait for them. They would have been due 31st October 2011 but the accounting reference date seems to have changed to 29th June, as allowed for in the Companies Act 2006, and so will not now be due until 15th March 2012, per their Companies House record. If all was well with those terrific investments (LM Logisics being a total loss of £609,000 aside), why extend?”
Rangers’ Negotiations With HMRC: The Truth Is In There 32 1552 35322 2 30/12/2011 1:9:0 OnandOnandOnand 169 22 “Hugh
Rangers’ Negotiations With HMRC: The Truth Is In There 32 1554 35324 4 30/12/2011 1:28:0 OnandOnandOnand 169 23 “I have to apologise for an earlier misleading comment, I said the loss on LM Logistics (the one featured in the BBC documentary) was £609,000, I forgot about the other £100,000 or £105,000, not sure which, lost in the original LM, the one that went into CVA, bringing the total loss up to £714,000.
Why does this matter? It wasn’t Wee Craigie’s money that was lost, it was small investors, some greedy, some desperate, lured by the promise of 9.25% return, far higher than you can get elsewhere. The accounts don’t mention it. I appreciate it was after the accounting date for MCR but it was a material event.
Pensioners, people nearing retirement, they’ve lost that investment, so now have to rely on the performance of Countryliner, a near bankrupt bus company in south England worth diddley squat to pay their money. It could be your parents/grandparents who have lost their savings in this company. These funds were flagged up as high risk but some financial accumen would have been assumed in choosing the investments. They were turnarounds, but has Wee Craigie done the business? I think we still await his first success, for sure, it isn’t going to be Rangers”
Rangers’ Negotiations With HMRC: The Truth Is In There 32 1556 35326 6 30/12/2011 1:43:0 OnandOnandOnand 169 24 “Sorry, also forgot to mention that the investment by ordinary people in MCR was a mere £2m, about £300,000 of which went on ‘fees’.”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 2 100 35464 50 30/12/2011 16:36:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 1 “There is no time limit for the annoucement. The takeover itself was posted at 20.44 on 6th May”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 3 112 35476 12 30/12/2011 17:8:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 2 “Adam
If push comes to shove, they can letterbox the accounts at Companies House tomorrow. see holiday opening times on CH homepage”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 3 119 35483 19 30/12/2011 17:23:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 3 “Adam
My point is to do with lodging of the accounts and thus avoiding criminal sanctions. l previously posted the same view as you, that it would be Wed/Thurs before they would be available at CH. As a seperate issue, they have a market obligation to publish such information through newswire/Plus”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 3 136 35500 36 30/12/2011 18:9:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 4 “Adam @ 5.51
I’m 100% sure that there is no filtering process, the directors are responsible for the information put out on newswire. where l’m not 100% certain is that plc can lodge its accounts electronically, l thought that was only for small companies”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 14 699 36081 49 2/1/2012 12:56:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 5 “Just to be clear, electronic filing is only available to audit exempt or dormant companies.
Hard copy accounts could be letterboxed at any time before midnight on 31st.
All questions about lodging of accounts should be made clear in a few days time. Patience, people.”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 17 818 36206 18 2/1/2012 21:38:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 6 “The idea of Rangers fans getting together and buying the club back has an almost romantic notion about it. I spoke with a ‘Bear’ on Friday night who assured me that the subject had been raised by Rangers fans at Celtic Park last week and no-one objected to investing £500 a head. He was sure that they could raise the money needed, even if it was £35m, to pay the tax man and save the club. Interestingly, he acknowledged that the club would lose the tax case.
When I pointed out that they would also have to find the money to buy Wee Craigie out too, maybe £30-40m, plug the £10m black hole, pay the overdue back tax and VAT and also provide some working capital before the club would be saved, he had no answer. He asked me how I came to work this out, He knows my business background and is well aware I can reach conclusions all by myself but when I referred him to rangerstaxcase.wordpress.com I got a diatribe about how it was a biased website intent on bringing the club down.
With that mindset, the conclusion reached by Chico/Watson on Only and Excuse was just about right.
Besides, Whyte will not sell, that’s not the gameplan. Once the FTT(T) has heard all the evidence and submissions, he will be free to move to Receivership as the Tribunal will give its decision regarless of the financial state of Rangers. Whyte needs at least a couple of months to get the PR in full swing (Saviour of the club, insolvency inevitable, fault of old board) before the new season ticket money is raised so my best guess is that he will move before or on Valentine’s day”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 17 825 36213 25 2/1/2012 22:15:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 7 “abrahamtoast says:
02/01/2012 at 10:05 pm
If there was a share issue, all those bears who now say they would chip in £500 would disappear like snow off a dyke!
Apparently, the general agreement was that they didn’t invest when £50m was asked for as it was seen as lining SDM’s pockets, this time it would be to save the club. I have no reason to disbelieve that Rangers fans might well invest this time, given the near death perception about just the tax case, just as Celtic fans bought into the Fergus vision when they realised how necessary it was. Trouble is, the Rangers fans have no real source of information to show them what the realities are. Until people on FF start copying and pasting parts of this blog to spell it out, that information will remain hidden.
Not all FF posters and readers are mindless. One of the first real in depth critiques of Wee Craigie, warning of his less than shining past, was posted on FF in February (perhaps around the time the unpublished PI report was being prepared for the Independant Board)”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 17 826 36214 26 2/1/2012 22:18:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 8 “Hugh @ 10.09
His words, not mine.
As to Whyte selling, who would buy it (in this universe)?”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 17 834 36222 34 2/1/2012 22:39:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 9 “abrahamtoast says:
02/01/2012 at 10:33 pm
Can’t say that I disagree with you there in terms of the first paragraph.
As to the second, I’m not so sure that such a presumption exists this time round. I get the sense that there are Rangers fans realising they have to do something, they just don’t know what that ‘something’ is and have unrealistic expectations as to how deep the abyss is”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 18 853 36244 3 2/1/2012 23:23:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 10 “Wee Craigie will portray himself as a skilled heart surgeon, transferring the ‘beating heart’ of Rangers from one limited company to another when Receivership hits but the club will live on, so the argument will go. He will steal the heritage into his own wholly owned company.
If I were a person of standing in the Rangers psyche, I would be raising the standard now, Not The Wee Craigie Rangers, transfer the heart here and urge the support to follow. All it takes is for the support to delay taking up season tickets and the whole Wavetower edifice falls. It is a castle built on sand. Let Wavetower take the assets, then don’t buy the season tickets, it will be in administration in weeks. NTWCR will pick up Ibrox from the administrator of Wavetower for a fraction of its current value.
Hugh, yes, I know, HMRC still get stuffed in this scenario, as well as others, but that’s going to happen anyway. Wavetower has far less right to the Rangers brand than its supporters”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 18 856 36247 6 2/1/2012 23:29:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 11 “Arfurfuxake says:
02/01/2012 at 11:12 pm
Just print the posts?? FFS, Paul McConville’s alone would be more than War and Peace length…………
Paul, chapeau, keep them coming”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 18 860 36251 10 2/1/2012 23:38:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 12 “Arfurfuxake says:
02/01/2012 at 11:32 pm
As was mine………. but wee smiley faces elude my skills………… and that is not a cue for Lord Wobbly to give me the same lessons he gave the Don in how to create then, please
The ‘chapeau’ was sincerely meant (sincere face)”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 18 863 36254 13 2/1/2012 23:42:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 13 “Goosy
Do we get to keep the bike? Or will Wee Craigie use it to ride into the sunset….”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 18 866 36257 16 2/1/2012 23:48:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 14 “Goosy
Legend has it that Ally has already had a shot…… or was it Davie Cooper?”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 18 870 36261 20 2/1/2012 23:58:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 15 “Lord Wobbly says:
02/01/2012 at 11:53 pm
With apologies to Spike Milligan, how about
‘Craig Whyte, My Part In His Downfall'”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 18 874 36265 24 3/1/2012 0:4:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 16 “Now, let’s get back to the Mouldmaster………”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 18 877 36268 27 3/1/2012 0:10:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 17 “My Don
I recently spent several nights watching you and your family on the telly. Seemed a fairly typical family from the Calton but with better weather and canolli”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 18 883 36274 33 3/1/2012 0:21:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 18 “rangerstaxcase says:
02/01/2012 at 11:48 pm
02/01/2012 at 11:29 pm (Edit)
The data I have proves that Whyte had not put in the £6.7m promised by 30 June. However, there is no obligation to release data for any period after that.
He may have put it in, but did he take it straight back out again?”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 19 925 36318 25 3/1/2012 10:4:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 19 “If only Wee Craigie had listened to Sir Humphrey Appleby, he may not have embarked on this folly
Notwithstanding the fact that your proposal could conceivably encompass certain concomitant benefits of a marginal and peripheral relevance, there is a countervailing consideration of infinitely superior magnitude involving your personal complicity and corroborative malfeasance, with a consequence that the taint and stigma of your former associations and diversions could irredeemably and irretrievably invalidate your position and culminate in public revelations and recriminations of a profoundly embarrassing and ultimately indefensible character.
I got the boxed set from Santa”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 28 1382 36809 32 4/1/2012 15:40:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 20 “rangerstaxcase says:
04/01/2012 at 3:33 pm
The actual percentage is 0%
The whole point of a pre-pack is that the deal is done straight away with the creditors getting their report within 8 weeks. Creditors can object after the event but if the assets are soldor transferred, not a lot they can do about it. This process is clearly open to abuse and a special Statement of Insolvency Practice was introduced reminding administrators of their duty to get the best deal.
Receivership requires yet another 0% acceptance from creditors. If the assets are claimed to have been sold or transferred at undervalue, both creditors and a liquidator subsequently appointed may callenge this and sue the receiver personally.”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 28 1384 36812 34 4/1/2012 15:45:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 21 “This is quite a good layman’s guide to pre-packs
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 28 1385 36813 35 4/1/2012 15:47:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 22 “Hugh McEwan says:
04/01/2012 at 3:42 pm
I’ll bet they won’t get DM Hall to do the ‘independant valuation'”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 28 1388 36816 38 4/1/2012 15:56:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 23 “TBK @3.51pm
I think they will have already covered their backs by getting low valuations from various sources, remember, the IP is not obliged to get going concern valuations. I expect the IP appointed to be pretty bullet proof in terms of his/her actions but still wouldn’t stop a challenge. I expect the fee will reflect this.
(lHuge grinning face)”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 28 1394 36823 44 4/1/2012 16:10:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 24 “campsiejoe says:
04/01/2012 at 4:00 pm
Joe, again, the values in the accounts are going conern (ignoring the possibility that they may well be in excess of that), the breakup value will be much less. For example, an engineering firm has a piece of kit on its books at £245k, it sells at auction for £40k with the buyer having to pay the costs of removal and auctioneer’s premium. All open and above board, market tested. Another piece of kit, same spec, has to be valued for break up sale. Estimate would be £40k. Assets get valued on a breakup basis all the time for sums that bear no apparent relationship to their book value. Go to the local auctioneers, Sweeney Kincaid and look at the bids being put in for lots
That site deals with commercial assets but the same principals apply for all other assets, including players.”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 28 1396 36826 46 4/1/2012 16:13:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 25 “TheBlackKnight says:
04/01/2012 at 4:04 pm
I’m certain that low valuations will not be disclosed to the auditors, held in a locked cupboard where only Wee Craigie has the 4 digit combination (it’s 1690)”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 28 1399 36829 49 4/1/2012 16:19:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 26 “campsiejoe says:
04/01/2012 at 4:14 pm
Questions can of course be asked but if the valuation has been given by a professional with experience in that field, not easy to challenge unless manifestly wrong and that would be for a court to decide. I have a Dad’s taxi appointment now, hope that helped”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 31 1515 36955 15 4/1/2012 23:27:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 27 “Barcabhoy says:
04/01/2012 at 10:55 pm
I am also on record agreeing some time ago that any newco Rangers should start from Division 3 and that’s a view a number of supporters I know share in. Given the complete arse Wee Craigie is making of everything, I can’t see how it can be otherwise, never mind the morality of what was done in the past.
Neither the SPL nor SFA will want much to do with him given his talent for bringing the game into disrepute by his broken promises of funds for the team, disgraceful treatment of former directors and complete disregard of corporate governance.
I’m not even sure newco works if he is involved as I’m pretty sure there is more to tell about him. If my analysis of his plan is correct, it involves continued support to fund the on-going if slimmed down operation. There enough fans and Bears out there questioning his abilities to bring that support down and with it, the whole newco fiasco. Quite frankly, that would suit me, it might mean that genuine Rangers supporters get the chance to take the club back from its present owner. It might take 4 or 5 years to get back to the SPL or whatever it is by that time but so be it.”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 31 1530 36974 30 4/1/2012 23:59:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 28 “calderon says:
04/01/2012 at 11:54 pm
04/01/2012 at 10:56 pm
In further homage to Peter Greenaway:
The Daft Man’s Contract
That’s got to be a front runner (smiley face)”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 32 1585 37034 35 5/1/2012 10:35:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 29 “Who is on Clyde 1 tonight? Please, please let it be Keevins…….. I have my 20p ready for the call”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 32 1589 37038 39 5/1/2012 10:45:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 30 “TBK
1989!! I think it was 10p then, I had allowed for inflation but obviously not enough”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 33 1626 37075 26 5/1/2012 12:3:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 31 “From the department of ‘They just don’t get it’
This is part of a response to the Drum article highlighted by tenerifetim above
‘And one other thing about Rangers Tax Case. There is obviously excellent technical knowledge of finance and accountancy there. Why any sports journalist should be expected to understand complex tax law is a ludicrous hypothesis.’
Is it ludicrous to expect a sports journalist (or ex sports journalists) to understand the basics of the tax issues? How many times has this been spelled out on here in terms even the most simple minded journalist could understand.?”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 33 1634 37083 34 5/1/2012 12:23:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 32 “Aw feck, looks like Jabba is going and Keevins is staying. I’m off to spend my 20p
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 37 1807 37259 7 5/1/2012 19:28:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 33 “The Don @6.55pm
l don’t think this will be a hive down. Such a procedure was used to create a new, clean and debt free company, owned by the receiver which could then be sold on cleanly to a willing buyer.
What Whyte will do is transfer the assets to Wavetower in satisfaction of the debt.”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 37 1835 37288 35 5/1/2012 20:27:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 34 “Can I expand on my earlier posting about hive down in answer to the Don’s lengthy posting.
Pre 2003, hive downs were commonly used. In the main, banks appointed receivers under their floating charge. The banks weren’t interested in the assets, only the cash the receiver got for selling them. A hive down was a way to achieve clean assets. The receiver was only an agent of the company and any sale of assets could be subject to carrying liabilities. In the 70’s and 80’s, tax losses were an important part of the asset base and those losses could be passed down as part of the hive down. All the assets were hived down to a non trading newco where the sahres were held by the receiver. The receiver then sold that newco to the buyer. This procedure meant that a willing buyer could be sure they were getting assets, goodwill, tax losses, the lot with a clean title.
The tax loss issue became less relevant over time as the scope for claiming these was eroded by legislation closing tax ‘loopholes’
After 2003, an administrator could pass clean title without the need for a hive down and a simple asset sale/ purchase agreement become the usual mode of transferring title.
In this case, unlike a bank, the floating chargeholder, Wavetower, wants the assets, not the cash. It will enter into a sale/purchase agreement with the receiver and the ‘price’ paid will not be cash but reduction of the Wavetower debt in exchange for the assets.”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 37 1842 37297 42 5/1/2012 20:36:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 35 “The Don @8.31pm
Actually, and for this I apologise in advance, I am disagreeing with you and RTC, there will be no hive down, just a straight transfer. There will be no bidding for the assets, no-one will be allowed to bid. The Instrument of Appointment will be delivered at 6pm and the deal will be signed up at 6.10pm. I’m old and ugly enough to remember the tactics pre-2003.”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 37 1844 37300 44 5/1/2012 20:42:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 36 “Hugh McEwan says:
05/01/2012 at 8:39 pm
It would be a form of pre-pack but really a stitch up, but the Wavetower debt will be £30m+ by now so they will be able to justify it.
Yes, the break up valuations are in the safe
Pre 2003 receiverships were a dirty business”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 37 1848 37304 48 5/1/2012 20:48:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 37 “A wee story.
A good going pub company, 2 directors/shareholders, asset value £2m, bank are owed £1m. The bank are well in with one director in other deals, dont know the other director who owns 51% of the shares. Directors fall out. Bank take the hump and appoint a receiver who sells the pubs to the favoured director for £1.03m, which pays back the bank and covers fees. One director has the lot, the other has nothing. And the bank lent the favoured director the money to do the deal.
Yep, but that can’t be true, can it?”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 38 1852 37308 2 5/1/2012 20:51:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 38 “campsiejoe says:
05/01/2012 at 8:43 pm
If Wavetower are owed £30m+, then yes, the break up value may well be lass than that.
Wavetower paid £21m to Lloyds, add capitalised values of transfers, facility fees, arrangement fees etc, £30m can be achieved”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 38 1852 37308 2 5/1/2012 20:51:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 38 “campsiejoe says:
05/01/2012 at 8:43 pm
If Wavetower are owed £30m+, then yes, the break up value may well be lass than that.
Wavetower paid £21m to Lloyds, add capitalised values of transfers, facility fees, arrangement fees etc, £30m can be achieved”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 38 1854 37310 4 5/1/2012 20:51:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 39 “‘less'”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 38 1859 37315 9 5/1/2012 20:53:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 40 “the Don Dionisio says:
05/01/2012 at 8:51 pm
I’m pretty confident the valuations will already be in place, just waiting to be updated nearer the day”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 38 1861 37317 11 5/1/2012 20:54:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 41 “TheBlackKnight says:
05/01/2012 at 8:52 pm
It was pre 2003, when pubs used to make money……..”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 38 1870 37326 20 5/1/2012 21:1:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 42 “rangerstaxcase says:
05/01/2012 at 8:57 pm
If the valuations are properly carried out and can be stacked up, the Receiver will be able to justify his actions (and his/her fee will be commensurate with the risk of such action).
We discussed valuations yesterday, can’t see any way a ‘price’ of £30m equating to break up values would be challenged”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 38 1879 37335 29 5/1/2012 21:19:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 43 “Despite all my postings about the mechanism for Wee Craigie getting his hands on the assets, I stand by what I have said in the last few days (and months, come to think of it), I think this has all gone so far off the rails for him that the crashing of waves against the tower will be heard shortly after he makes his move as he drowns in a sea of debt. If the SFA hold on to the pair they grew when dealing with Hearts, his possible smooth ride into the SPL will not happen. Where does he go from there? Division 3 was never in his plans”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 38 1889 37346 39 5/1/2012 21:34:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 44 “TheBlackKnight says:
05/01/2012 at 9:31 pm
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 38 1891 37348 41 5/1/2012 21:37:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 45 “TheBlackKnight says:
05/01/2012 at 9:31 pm
Sorry for the brevity but am watching the Vatarsay Boys on BBC Alba.
In any event, my answer was complete and to the point.”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 38 1893 37350 43 5/1/2012 21:40:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 46 “Vatersay, my grandfather would kill me for that typo”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 38 1900 37357 50 5/1/2012 21:50:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 47 “longtimelurker says:
05/01/2012 at 9:46 pm
I am indeed a Rangers man but how can you not like the Vatersay Boys???? Okay, Celtic to a man but I have been to a few of their ‘performances’, best times.”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 39 1912 37369 12 5/1/2012 22:13:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 48 “longtimelurker says:
05/01/2012 at 9:46 pm
Barra and Vatersay in May/June when the machair is at its best, agreed.
We seem to have run out of steam a bitt, maybe everyone is giving deep consideration to the next event. I think not much will happen until after the FTT(T). I can’t see accounts being lodged, that would be a no-win for Wee Craigie unless they were whyter than whyte. I don’t think he ever intended to lodge them, he just wants the hearing phase of the Tribunal over so that he can make his move. Grant Thornton can sing for their money if they haven’t been paid up front.”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 39 1915 37372 15 5/1/2012 22:18:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 49 “nowoldandgrumpy says:
05/01/2012 at 10:00 pm
Wasn’t that a case about use of tax losses?”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 39 1929 37386 29 5/1/2012 22:31:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 50 “TheBlackKnight says:
05/01/2012 at 10:24 pm
Thanks, I remember reading that case while waiting on a plane”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 39 1933 37390 33 5/1/2012 22:37:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 51 “Goosy says:
05/01/2012 at 10:32 pm
Don’t be too sure about the profit, he’s made a total arse of it, Wee Craigie might be in deep doo doo soon enough”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 39 1937 37394 37 5/1/2012 22:49:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 52 “TheBlackKnight says:
05/01/2012 at 10:39 pm
I must admit to being a bit rusty on the rules on passing of losses. Given that Rangers and Wavetower post transfer may be in the same business, it may be possible that Rangers’ tax losses may be available to Wavetower but how would it use them unless it expected to make significant footballing profits? (Tax experts, if the losses could be transferred, could they then be used by non-footballing future subsidiaries of Wavetower?)”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 39 1941 37398 41 5/1/2012 22:56:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 53 “Newsnight now…….”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 40 1965 37422 15 5/1/2012 23:35:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 54 “I suggest a test for all us so verbose posters, myself included.
‘Would Jean understand this?’
Jeannie is the litmus test, by her own admission, much of what is posted here is over her head. (but you seem to get it anyway,) We critiscise Rangers fans for not understanding the reality of what is going on but if Jeannie doesn’t get it, we shouldn’t criticise others. it is up to us to explain in terms that jeannie gets and up to Jeannie to pull us up and jeannie to tell us what she wants explained again. )
Jean, if that sounds patronising, I am sorry.”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 40 1972 37429 22 5/1/2012 23:47:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 55 “Hugh McEwan says:
05/01/2012 at 11:37 pm
is that a code?”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 40 1978 37435 28 5/1/2012 23:54:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 56 “I shall await Jean’s judgement”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 40 1988 37445 38 6/1/2012 0:4:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 57 “jean says:
05/01/2012 at 11:51 pm
05/01/2012 at 11:35 pm
No it is not patronising as most of this is outwith my scope of experience. Whilst I am not a lawyer or an accountant I am educated enough to extrapolate from the available data what I need to know……..not everyone can do that.
I understand to a large degree what’s happening although, sometimes you lot go off on a tangent and the discussion becomes more complex when you get into all the intricities of the subject matter. I don’t deny that it can be quite intimidating to the uninitiated but I do try to ask when I don’t understand something.
Juse a tip guys …if you act daft enough for long enough no one will expect anymore of you and that way you get to surprise people at times
Just posting this again so that some of you wil read it and remeber it’s not about ‘us guys'”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 41 2004 37461 4 6/1/2012 0:21:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 58 “Corsica
Publish the letter from Companies House that says that they are aware of CW’s past. Anonise it”
Concern About Rangers As A Going-Concern? 41 2017 37476 17 6/1/2012 1:5:0 OnandOnandOnand 41 59 “Slimshady says:
06/01/2012 at 12:36 am
Your philosophy is similar to mine which is ‘ assume everyone else is smarter than you are, that way you won’t be disappointed and, quite often, you’ll be pleasantly surprised.
Onand x 3 ‘ your comment whilst not intended to be patronising, was very patronising x 3
I apologise X 3”